Author Topic: Best street usage 2.5 mods.  (Read 7973 times)

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Castr8r

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #15 on: July 04, 2008, 06:31:22 PM »
Dudley- go for the Clifford header!   And it works well with the Clifford cam; the big problem being that they're spendy.  My banger has some other stuff like a homemade 1" TB spacer, and a homade/temporary intake that I'm working on.   My Jeep has showed up some pretty fancy built rigs.  It's lifted (and sagging) on 33"s and regeared with 4.88. I use it primarily as a trail Jeep, but really enjoy driving it on road, too.   By the way Kids, I'm 66, retired, and enjoying it!

dudley

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2008, 05:11:28 AM »
Dudley- go for the Clifford header!   And it works well with the Clifford cam; the big problem being that they're spendy.  My banger has some other stuff like a homemade 1" TB spacer, and a homade/temporary intake that I'm working on.   My Jeep has showed up some pretty fancy built rigs.  It's lifted (and sagging) on 33"s and regeared with 4.88. I use it primarily as a trail Jeep, but really enjoy driving it on road, too.   By the way Kids, I'm 66, retired, and enjoying it!
I have the header on the bench in the garage.  When I have the extra cash to buy a free flow converter and the cost of altering the head pipe to hook her up, it'll be a done deal! I don't have a clifford cam, but do have one by Delta already in. It is one bump up from stock in specs.  My 2.5 is in an stock comanche 4x2 SWB with nothing power on the engine and a 4 speed. I will later put a hayden electric fan in place of the stock water pump clutch one. I am guestamating that based on Cliffords comments, my 117hp will bump up to about 140 with all that stuff on.   Now, if they just made a throttle body spacer for my 87! :beers:
BTW, I am now 15 days shy of 60! Hard to get the need for speed out of old school hotrodders! :baby:

dudley

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2008, 02:29:23 PM »
Hey, Castr8r :
You seem to like the Clifford header.  Did it do as promised, jump up the hp pretty good?  Can you tell if it also helped gas milage?  Any low end losses?

Castr8r

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2008, 11:33:36 AM »
I can't tell you that the work I did on my engine made it perform way better than stock, 'cause my motor was so thoroughly "sanded" that ANYTHING was an improvement!  That being said, I can consistently out perform any other banger that it has come up against.  We're not talking drag raceing, but on the trail and in the boonies.  Further, it will do better than most six cylinder Jeeps to a point, that being road speed.  I can maintain  65 mph  in fifth gear now, but a steep hill means a downshift, where a six will lug on thru.  I can't discuss mileage- my odometer has never worked!  Seat of the pants says it is a lot better; I don't fill up as often.  Probably the best thing about the Clifford header is the design- long tubes- that translates into torque.  I think it was Dr.Duntov that said "torque is what moves a vehicle, horsepower is what sells it..."  My mods have been primarily aimed at developing torque, and freeing up horsepower.   My latest 'brain fart ' involves making intake ports a little smaller to increase low rpm air velocity, and help make torque by maintaining fuel suspension and mix in the air flow.  I have a couple of spare heads to work with...   I want the torque and power to come on at low rpm's, and seem to have been fortunate in my mods doing just that so far.  OK, so I'm windy, too.  Hope this helps you out.     Do it dirty!

dudley

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2008, 02:10:30 PM »
  OK, so I'm windy, too.  Hope this helps you out.     Do it dirty!
Sounds good!   Mine being nothing but a highway rig, and that it will be a couple of months before the few hundred to get a free flow converter (old one's done for anyway) and the necessary mods to the head pipe, I will post my "seat of the pants" analysis!

Offline Bounty Hunter

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #20 on: July 08, 2008, 04:07:47 PM »
I just got another batch of 62mm throttle bodies for all those that have PM'd me with interest in them.  $95 each while they last.  Have one 62mm spacer, don't know when I'll have more once it is gone.  bountyhunter AT sija.org is the best way to reach me.

Offline chrisfranklin

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #21 on: July 13, 2008, 07:56:32 PM »
I have tried a variety of intakes - stock, w/KN panel, Cone with metal tube, back to stock and paper.  The one thing that alway bugged me about any of the so-called cold air setups for Wranglers was the heat-soak you'd still be facing having the intake manifold right above the exhaust manifold.  Touch the intake manifold some time after you've been driving for a while -- it'll be burning hot.

I was going to leave everything stock -- airbox and paper filter -- and just wrap the intake manfold in some thermotec tape.  But I said "what if I took this cold air business a little further."  And of course a project insued:

 




With the apparent intake temperature drop, low end is nice now.  You move out a lot quicker.  At highway speeds you do probably get a slight positive pressure, too -- like 1/10th of 1%  :lol: I don't have the plastic rectangualr headlight pieces in place currently and I have both my front signal lights out.  I put all that stuff in and I am going to have to attach something to the grill that flows incoming air past the grill to the left side where the intake opening is.  This should cut out any heat perhaps given off by the radiator as well. 

As for water intake, not much chance  -- its not one of these Honda cone-filter under the bumper deals.  I need to go through water I'll just unscrew the hose from the metal behind the grill and leave it high in the engine bay.

But point of all this is, yeah you can get some good results out of the 4Banger using the heat wrap products by Thermotec and then do a little filter shopping and metal hole boring
'94 YJ S 5spd, Borla Exhaust, CarSound Cat., PS Ceramic-coated Headers, Airraid intake, 62mm TB, Intake Manifold bored/ceramic-coated, 19lb injectors, Sharp's Adj. FPR, MeanGreen Starter, D30 Aussie locker, 31" Destination MTs, Warn XD9000, Cibie headlights, armor

Offline chardrc

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #22 on: July 13, 2008, 08:13:25 PM »
we used to have heat problems with our cjs. the gas would boil in the carb when we where in Colorado... so we got / made headers for it and wrapped them with heat rap. which helped our performance allot because 1 we got better exhaust flow  with the new header and exhaust. and the old exhaust manifold actually bolted to the intake manifold so it transferred allot of heat... so i guess what im saying is that heat wrap works (as mentioned above) and you can also heat rap your exhaust to keep it from escaping but that usually more applies and is easier to do when you have headers.

another thing to consider is that the intake manifold does have coolant flowing through it so it will be the same temp as your motor (give or take). but that is much cooler than the exhaust.
1990 YJ 4cly, ax5, 2.5 inch BDS lift, 31 MTr\'s,  Powertrax-lockers all around, track-bars removed, boomerang shackles, warn m8000 winch, electric fan. [sold but not forgotten]

2007 jk Rubicon 2dr

Mr_Random

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2008, 11:12:00 PM »
we used to have heat problems with our cjs. the gas would boil in the carb when we where in Colorado... so we got / made headers for it and wrapped them with heat rap. which helped our performance allot because 1 we got better exhaust flow  with the new header and exhaust. and the old exhaust manifold actually bolted to the intake manifold so it transferred allot of heat... so i guess what im saying is that heat wrap works (as mentioned above) and you can also heat rap your exhaust to keep it from escaping but that usually more applies and is easier to do when you have headers.

another thing to consider is that the intake manifold does have coolant flowing through it so it will be the same temp as your motor (give or take). but that is much cooler than the exhaust.

Your second paragraph only applies to pre 1991 YJ/MJ/XJ's, the MPI manifolds weren't heated. The theory on the TBI/Carb models was that the heated gas/fuel mixture would atomize more cleanly and also be heated (duh) to reach the proper operating temperature faster. MPI negates the need because the fuel is directed just above the valves and has very little time to mix with intake air (but is already atomized well enough it doesn't need more time).

I'm getting along on my MPI conversion, I need one last major part; the gas tank and fuel pump, plus TONS of little pieces (all the sensors, ignition coil, fuel lines, vac lines, etc).

Offline chardrc

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #24 on: July 14, 2008, 05:28:54 PM »
ok thanks for clearing that up... good luck with the conversion
1990 YJ 4cly, ax5, 2.5 inch BDS lift, 31 MTr\'s,  Powertrax-lockers all around, track-bars removed, boomerang shackles, warn m8000 winch, electric fan. [sold but not forgotten]

2007 jk Rubicon 2dr

Oilsmoke

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #25 on: August 30, 2008, 01:35:43 PM »
dudley

What Brand Front tube do you Have?

I been doing a little Exhaust work On my Jeep this last month. Front tube Is Next in my Total Stainless Steel Exhaust Setup Last and Hardest part.

dudley

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #26 on: September 06, 2008, 06:38:02 AM »
Installed my clifford header finally!  Seat of pants determination; seems to help.  My comanche 4x2 is a street driver only, and the hills on the interstate seem less of a pull for the 4 banger.
Did have an installation problem though.  The header is built with the front two tubes collecting into one tube, the back two collecting into one tube, and those two then going into the collector.  The "Y" where the front two came together was touching my block at the pan.  I tapped in the edge of the pan, but that did not help. I called Clifford and they said they never had that problem before. They suggested having a local exhaust shop bend the 4 tubes some to get it to clear.  Neither shop in my town would do that since it would make them liable for any problems. After a few frustrating calls to Clifford I flattened the back side of the "Y" touching the block. Did not use heatt.  Now the collector was hitting my bell housing!
So Clifford had me send them back, shipping at their expense, to modify them plus check them with their jig. They claim it fit their jig perfectly but loosened up the two Y's and turned them out a bit.  Received them back and the front "Y" still touched.  I called clifford again and said I was tired of fighting this and wanted my money back.  They said they could not do that since they , at my request, modified them.  I told them since they claim this header fits all 2.5's from, I think they said, 86 to 91, and mine is an 87, the reason for my problem is obviously a fault with they way this header was made.  They still refused.  Needless to say, I told them this left me with no choice but to never buy clifford products again, and let others know how I was treated.
After hanging up I went to the shop where the head pipe would be fitted to my header, and he said "I will hold the torch while you hit the header and flatten out the 'Y' area."  I did, they now barely clear, and it's on the street.  Don't think it gave me the 15 or more % increase in hp they claimed although it did help some.

Castr8r

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #27 on: September 08, 2008, 10:38:46 PM »
Damn Dudley- I'm sorry that you had problems with the Clifford header.  I feel like I let you down by recommending it.  Mine fits well; no spacers, rubbing, tight clearances, or whatever; so I beleive that there must be a problem with Clifford's process.  I'm sorry for that.   I am glad that it seems to have provided a bit of "boost".  I'm wondering if you have a cam, or are you planning on one?  Some of what I've read indicates that full benefit of the header will come with a cam installation.  Be sure to check the header/intake bolts for tightness quite often for a while- mine still tended to loosen up two months later, but seem to have reached a "set" now, and haven't needed to retorque for some time (and I do still check them on a regular basis).   Better luck next time.
Castr8r

pioneer4x4

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #28 on: September 09, 2008, 02:04:42 PM »
I purchased a set of clifford headers for my 86 XJ and the first go around they sent me wrong headers all together, the second time its missing the O2 sensor bung not a big deal just welded one after collector,and the egr tube doesnt allign, had to cut it and am using a rubber hose for the mean time, also the header pipe is contacting the motor where the oil pan bolts to the motor. didnt really notice any gains. I had a rough time with those people, but we all are human.

Offline Bounty Hunter

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Re: Best street usage 2.5 mods.
« Reply #29 on: September 09, 2008, 03:00:44 PM »
I've got a Banks header on the way, anybody had any issues with them?