4bangerjp.com
General Forums => The Mess Hall => Topic started by: stan98tj on July 18, 2011, 06:34:42 PM
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When i come home in Oct, it's finally going to be time for the regear and axle upgrade. Money won't be much of a concern (though id like to keep this under 4k) and im still tryin to decide between going 4.56 or 4.10 (3spd auto and 33s).
THe guy im talking to about regearing has a super35 he built wiht 4.56 gears, ARB locker, welded tubes. 5yrs old and can be had for a reasonable price. He's offered it to me in the past and i dont remember the exact price but i recall thinking it was cheap. I on the other hand was planning to lock my front with an e-locker and keep the rear open but have a dana 44 or an 8.8 back there. THe super 35 sounds tempting but ive read guys on here stating that its just an overpriced turd.
Thoughts? Is it going to be as strong as a 44 or 8.8? With the 4cyl, will i need something as strong as an 8.8 if im never going to go over 33s?
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When i come home in Oct, it's finally going to be time for the regear and axle upgrade. Money won't be much of a concern (though id like to keep this under 4k) and im still tryin to decide between going 4.56 or 4.10 (3spd auto and 33s).
THe guy im talking to about regearing has a super35 he built wiht 4.56 gears, ARB locker, welded tubes. 5yrs old and can be had for a reasonable price. He's offered it to me in the past and i dont remember the exact price but i recall thinking it was cheap. I on the other hand was planning to lock my front with an e-locker and keep the rear open but have a dana 44 or an 8.8 back there. THe super 35 sounds tempting but ive read guys on here stating that its just an overpriced turd.
Thoughts? Is it going to be as strong as a 44 or 8.8? With the 4cyl, will i need something as strong as an 8.8 if im never going to go over 33s?
it won't be as strong as a D44. You can add a weld-on truss and that can make the tubes rigid. Super 35 shafts are stronger than the stock 44 shafts but your carrier and R&P would still be smaller and weaker than the D44 ones. So you can make it close but not quite the same.
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If money wasn't a concern then I'd consider a 9".
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If money wasn't a concern then I'd consider a 9".
the 9" lacks the c-clip correct? that makes it better in case it snaps, the shaft won't come out? Im concerned with losing some ground clearance, will the pumpkin be hanging down like an anchor, ready to snag on rocks and stuff?
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the 9" lacks the c-clip correct? that makes it better in case it snaps, the shaft won't come out? Im concerned with losing some ground clearance, will the pumpkin be hanging down like an anchor, ready to snag on rocks and stuff?
The 9" is a half-step under the D60 as far as stock strength. No c-clips. removable 3rd member. You can shave the housing to gain some clearance. You can also get a high-pinion but that costs a lot more. Housing is lighter weight but still very strong as well. standard pinion is low but shouldn't be an issue. parts are generally pretty cheap. You used to be able to get low mileage Detroits for 9's cheap on ebay.
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is the 9'' full floater? (I have no idea how it's built, i'll do a search once i post this). If it is not a full floater design then if you break a shaft you can probably crawl a little to get out of the way but won't be able to drive it back home, won't spit the wheel out like the c-clip so there is an advantage to it. It unlikely to break the 9'' from what i understand but then again i'm not familiar with it so don't really know.
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wouldnt the 44 be plenty strong for the 4banger? i think we are all establishing that even with ARB locker, the super35 ive been offered is a waste? so between 44 and 8.8, would it be better to go for the 44? as far as the 9", it sounds real big and heavy. Im not sure where to get one either.
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wouldnt the 44 be plenty strong for the 4banger? i think we are all establishing that even with ARB locker, the super35 ive been offered is a waste? so between 44 and 8.8, would it be better to go for the 44? as far as the 9", it sounds real big and heavy. Im not sure where to get one either.
i wouldn't say it's a waste, with a truss i'm sure it can take way more abuse than a stock D35, but of course for the reasons presented before would still lack strength in some areas. A D44 with cromoly shafts would be a better choice imo for probably the same amount of money (if you consider all parts store bought exceptfor the axle itself).
Just looked and the 9'' is not full-floater, here's an article from a guy that made one using D44 fronts, too much money invested though
http://www.bc4x4.com/tech/2002/ff9/
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is the 9'' full floater? (I have no idea how it's built, i'll do a search once i post this). If it is not a full floater design then if you break a shaft you can probably crawl a little to get out of the way but won't be able to drive it back home, won't spit the wheel out like the c-clip so there is an advantage to it. It unlikely to break the 9'' from what i understand but then again i'm not familiar with it so don't really know.
You can have them built as FF's or SF.
wouldnt the 44 be plenty strong for the 4banger? i think we are all establishing that even with ARB locker, the super35 ive been offered is a waste? so between 44 and 8.8, would it be better to go for the 44? as far as the 9", it sounds real big and heavy. Im not sure where to get one either.
Personally, I'd probably consider a Toyota 8". The big advantage of the removable third-member is that gear changes are a lot easier. Pull it out and then you can change gears on a bench. Carry a second their-member and swap back and forth.
The 9" is probably going to be lighter then a 8.8". A 44 is strong but it really depends on how big you go. If you want to do 35's or larger then you'd be better off with the 9. If you're sticking with 33's or less then 44's are going to be fine.
I don't like the Super35 at all. They're expensive and you can build a JY axle for less. I'd consider a builder axle from say Currie or some other shop though. Especially if you can't handle the welding and such. Price would be too far off if you don't go crazy with the options.
If you want to do some welding then I'd consider JK D44's or even the J8 axles. Cheapest would be to find some TJ Rubicon axles. Yeah, they might not be the best but they are bolt-in and still strong then stock.
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I intend to stay at 33. What about between 8.8 and d44? Im asking because the guy who is going to do the work mentioned he can get an 8.8 easier than a d44. I can purchase a brand new d44 with the gearing i want from quadratec and still be within budget, but why spend extra on that if a cheaper 8.8 can do the job. I believe the 8.8 is c-clip so that would be a problem if it breaks. Spend the time and maybe the extra cash on getting a d44 or go with the 8.8?
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For a 4banger to break an 8.8 would take a lot out thrashing. I just put an 8.8 LSD in and the LSD locks up just like a full locker. So for under $1000 total - mounts, rebuild seals I have an axle that shouldnt ever cause any issues with me. I'm running 34 swampers (close to 33s really) and have absolutely no fear of the 8.8 snapping on me. Plus replacement parts for the 8.8 are all over and cheap. Not sure what gears but most 8.8s you can find with 4.10 and disc brakes. Even if you snap one the disc brakes will hold you together to get off the trail - (if its a last option). just my 2cents.
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With a 4k budget, a Currie 9" would be the best way to go. Another great option would be an exact width D44 (the 8.8 is a tad shorter). If you get the 8.8, make sure you get the tubes and center housing welded together by an expert, otherwise they will separate sooner or later.
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The D44 is going to be easier and faster since it's a bolt in for you. The 8.8 is going to need all the brackets and tubes welded. Both are strong enough for what you need. Personally I would do the D44 since they came from Jeep with one, there are plenty of upgrades if you choose to do them down the line. If you are buying brand new VS. used there is many places that have them ready to buy, or it wouldn't take long for them to build one for you.
Either way do the 4.56's.
Like others have said the 9 inch is the strongest if it's in your budget you should seriously think about it.
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The D44 is going to be easier and faster since it's a bolt in for you. The 8.8 is going to need all the brackets and tubes welded. Both are strong enough for what you need. Personally I would do the D44 since they came from Jeep with one, there are plenty of upgrades if you choose to do them down the line. If you are buying brand new VS. used there is many places that have them ready to buy, or it wouldn't take long for them to build one for you.
Either way do the 4.56's.
Like others have said the 9 inch is the strongest if it's in your budget you should seriously think about it.
You mean TJ D44 though.
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You mean TJ D44 though.
:nod: Isn't that what most companies use when they offer ready to bolt in D44's for a TJ?
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:nod: Isn't that what most companies use when they offer ready to bolt in D44's for a TJ?
Not necessarily. Unless they state it's a Mopar axle it's probably not.
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The G2 bolt in rear D44 looks like a really good deal at about $2400, with TJ brackets, gears, locker, heavy duty cover and shafts already included. Their front D44 has the disadvantage of reusing the D30 outers so you don't get the full benefit of a D44 (locking hubs, flat top knuckles, bigger brakes, etc.), plus it is low pinion. But the rear one looks very good. I would have seriously considered if it had been available when I got my D44 (for YJ).
http://www.g2axle.com/axle-assembly/rear-dana-assembly.aspx
http://www.4wd.com/Jeep-Drivetrain-Jeep-Axles-Differentials/G2-Rear-Dana-44-Axle-Assembly-for-Jeep.aspx?t_c=12&t_s=475&t_pt=100715&t_pl=101963
Rear D60s are also available for under $4k!
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The 8.75 mopar axle is a good choice too. Lot more work finding one and getting the brackets on ETC. but damn strong! It has a drop out like the Toyota and Ford 9 inch. Plus it's 5 on 4.5.
More info here. http://members.tripod.com/~Mojo_Page/chry875.htm
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The 8.75 mopar axle is a good choice too. Lot more work finding one and getting the brackets on ETC. but damn strong! It has a drop out like the Toyota and Ford 9 inch. Plus it's 5 on 4.5.
More info here. http://members.tripod.com/~Mojo_Page/chry875.htm
That was used in the A-Body, B-Body, C-Body and the E-Body. And with the 318, 340, 360, 383, 440 as well as the 426 Hemi. Many of which are rare or highly collectable. I don't think they're that easy to find though. No where as easy as say a D44 or a Toyota 8". I'd even wager to say the Grand Marquis/Town Car/ Crown Vic 9" would be easier to find.
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That was used in the A-Body, B-Body, C-Body and the E-Body. And with the 318, 340, 360, 383, 440 as well as the 426 Hemi. Many of which are rare or highly collectable. I don't think they're that easy to find though. No where as easy as say a D44 or a Toyota 8". I'd even wager to say the Grand Marquis/Town Car/ Crown Vic 9" would be easier to find.
There is a E body complete rearend on ebay for $250. I thought the D100-D200 pickups had them too.
I am sure the D44,9 inch,8.8 Toyota stuff is easier to find. Like anything, stuff is out there if you look hard enough.
Sounds like Stan's budget allows for a new axle anyway. Having a axle you can just bolt in is nice if you don't have time or tools/knowledge to build one yourself.
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Im gonna have my guy start looking in the junk yards for a TJ d44. I got a link to a place that sells them from time to time. If i cant get one that way, i think ill just cough up the extra $$ for a new one. Im not cutting corners on this particular project. Spend the cash to be happy in the long run, not short term.
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Im gonna have my guy start looking in the junk yards for a TJ d44. I got a link to a place that sells them from time to time. If i cant get one that way, i think ill just cough up the extra $$ for a new one. Im not cutting corners on this particular project. Spend the cash to be happy in the long run, not short term.
Honestly, you probably aren't saving much on a new axle especially if you're having someone else do the work for you. If you order it you don't really need a mechanic.
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i would still put a truss on the TJ D44, it has the D35 tubes so it's weak in that area.
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Honestly, you probably aren't saving much on a new axle especially if you're having someone else do the work for you. If you order it you don't really need a mechanic.
you are right, if i buy it new and complete with the gears in i can put it in myself
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8.8 is what i have. ill give you a price breakdown
Axle($250.00)
bracket kit(150.00)
misc.(100.00)((give or take))
your looking at around 500 bucks and you dont have to change rims.
now i have a waggy 44 sitting in my garage i picked up for free. plan on building that up as well.
i run 35x12.5x15 pitbull rockers and beat the tar out of it.
8.8 is a great axle i believe i plan on keeping it a long time. i know a guy with a 6 Cyl TJ and he run red label Maxxis Creepy Crawlers. and he has no issues.
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Is that true that the D35 actually has about 1" better clearance than the D44?
And: :wall:
Read that the Detroit in the Super 35 holds 30 spline axle shafts.
With that in mind, would it be possible to utilize a lunchbox locker, say an Aussie, designed for the
D44/ 30-spline shafts (one piece axles) and just fit that and 30 spline shafts in the D35 (similar to the Detroit/axle setup in the Super 35)?
Pretty sure that apart from a change to the Aussie's design to accommodate 30 spline shafts, the D44 Aussie has the same overall dimensions as the D35 Aussie
So, this would be a sort of lower-buck, partial Super 35...
( I know, when all is said and done, working on the the 35 overall, cost-benefit-wise, is probably like :deadhorse: any way you cut it in the long run) :lol:
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It's gonna come down between d44 and 8.8. Availability come sept-oct will prob be the the deciding factor. From the responses ive gotten it seems most would agree they are both great and some seem to lean towards the d44 as i was initially inclined. A good diff cover- like the SOLID brand one i have on the d30- to protect my investment, e-locker on the d30 and i should be good. ill also be going with 4.56 gears, which seem to be the popular advice esp from the guys here who actually run the 3spd auto and 33s.
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I just swapped in a D44 from a 2005 Rubicon with the actory air locker for $800. Great price and bolted right up to my 97TJ, alls i had to do was shorten my rear DS because the D44 pinion is 2" longer than a D35. Then had to make the e-brake work with the new axle because the D44 has a different attachment than the D35.
So axle $800, DS shortened and balanced $150, New 4.88's and master install kit with install $300. New Spicer 1310/1330 combo U- Joint $20( you will need this or change your DS to a 1330). Because a D44 uses a 1330 and a D35 uses a 1310.
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Aso out here in southern California, D44's from TJ's are hard to find. The junk yards usually only have cherokees and we have some places that scoop them up before they even hit the junk yards.
8.8s are easy to find, But work will need to be done to fit them on your Jeep. Also for $650 you could get a super88 kit that eiminates the c clips.
Those G2 axles are a good deal. for $2,500 you could get the 33 spline, 4.88's and a ARB air locker. You could always swap the G2 shafts for some superiors for $400 down the line.
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Aso out here in southern California, D44's from TJ's are hard to find. The junk yards usually only have cherokees and we have some places that scoop them up before they even hit the junk yards.
8.8s are easy to find, But work will need to be done to fit them on your Jeep. Also for $650 you could get a super88 kit that eiminates the c clips.
Those G2 axles are a good deal. for $2,500 you could get the 33 spline, 4.88's and a ARB air locker. You could always swap the G2 shafts for some superiors for $400 down the line.
i ordered 30 spline G2 axles and one of them was out of spec at the splines by quite a bit, returned them and got Alloy USA, imo stay away from G2, it's a bit of a lottery with their parts (i heard others having good experience with them but i didn't).
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ya i wouldnt buy there shafts or alloy usa, i have heard to much negative stuff about them.
Superior seems to be the way to go.
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I just put an 8.8 LSD in and the LSD locks up just like a full locker.
That's funny! No way in hell is a LSD is going to lock up like a locker.
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This is probably already readily known but here's a link to lookup parts. Seems good. Anyone with experience using it please input. I'm debating an 8.8 for my yj when funds are available.
http://www.car-part.com/index.htm
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Read that the Detroit in the Super 35 holds 30 spline axle shafts.
With that in mind, would it be possible to utilize a lunchbox locker, say an Aussie, designed for the
D44/ 30-spline shafts (one piece axles) and just fit that and 30 spline shafts in the D35 (similar to the Detroit/axle setup in the Super 35)?
Pretty sure that apart from a change to the Aussie's design to accommodate 30 spline shafts, the D44 Aussie has the same overall dimensions as the D35 Aussie
So, this would be a sort of lower-buck, partial Super 35...
So, is this theoretically possible (if maybe no where near as wise as a full-on swap to a D44 or 8.8)? :wall: