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General Forums => The Mess Hall => Topic started by: wrangler387 on April 21, 2006, 05:05:26 PM
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I just soldered up my stimulator board :) Tomorrow i will do the board, going out to fuddruckers (sp???) for a big ole burger and then a party :shock: After i get this board together and tested i'm going to start figuring out how i want to set it all up. Once i begin installing it into the Jeep i will take pictures of the whole process. Their is enough info on the megasquirt forums, that i didn't think it was necessary to take pictures of the board :wink:
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Thanks for the occasionaly heads up. I'm sure a lot of people are interested in this.
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no problem, i'm 20 years old and really do not care for college parties one bit. This is the first one i've been to in 2 years, and I realize now why i stopped going. But besides all of that, tomorrow afternoon/night i plan to solder up the megasquirt board :) I guess for now i'm going to just set it up using all of the stock fuel components :x I need to get a intake manifold and fuel rail to test fit and fab up a few things. Can't risk messing anything up on the jeep since it is my DD.
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I guess your 95 doesnt rely heavily on computer control? I'm just starting my research into a turbo/supercharger setup on the ol 2.5 but my 2000 wrangler has all the computer controls I cant really live without including the auto tranny. Unless I am mistaken and I can use MegaSquirt for fuel and timing withut losing gages and tranny. Any idea? I've been loking at the split second FT1 as my only other alternative.
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^ I wish i could tell you more about your obd2b and auto tranny situation. Some vehicles the auto transmission computer is comletely seperate from the ecu itself. I dont know to much about obd2, because most of what i've learned is from hondas, and you can buy a 60 dollar jumper harness and an obd1 computer and be done with all the extra obd2 crap. Have you tried searching the megasquirt forums about the auto tranny situtation? a long time ago there was a thread about controlling an automatic transmission using megasquirt. I'm leaving my stock ecu in the car to run my ignition and all of my guages. Once I get ignition through megasquirt i will still leave the stock ecu in my car for the gauges.
For an update on megasquirt, I didn't finish the board yesterday (i didnt realize how many hours it was goign to take). I have to do the "Input section construction & testing" section and the "output section construction & testing" In other words i may be half way done... For anyone looking to make their own board, its not hard, but does take time.
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keep in mind that on any obd2 vehicle most states are plugging into the computer to do inspection now... if they can't get all the info they need from the computer and there are any codes being thrown that woudl result from taking the computers functions away, you would fail...
just keep that in mind....
-Erik <--- not sure which states have that yet, but it seems like it's going everywhere eventually
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wrangler387 is a YJ'er. We don't care about the TJ's! :lol: j/k
There's only ODB1 on the YJ and assuming that any forced induction is removed, a switch should turn off the black box making it invisable.
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i was actually trying to point out to ballast the issues that might arise if he fooled with his obd2 computer system... though i'm sure with enough time and money you could steer clear of those.
interesting about the black box though.... if that same concept worked with obd2 and the obd2 computer didn't flip out, it should work fine with no CEL's
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Since I am in Florida and its an emissions free state, I shouldnt have an issue with testing. if emissions came back, I would have to get a mdified title I guess. I'm still trying to decide on turbo etc and think ODBII will behave better with a spitsecond FTC1 onboard vice the megasquirt. OBDII does change the way the game is played. Thanks for the response though, I will do a search on megasquirt to see if anyone has bypassed these issues.
I think megasquirt comes in at a little under $300 for a almost complete setup vice the $550 for splitsecond...that would be a huge chunk on exhaust work paid for.
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so i need to move to florida when i decide to build my next drag street car... nice to know hehe
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^ haha yes you do. nobody even runs catalytic converters down here. there are numerous 600whp+ hondas, 1000whp+ supras, camaros, stangs etc... ballast, where at in florida do you live?
The board is completed now!!!! :shock: checks out all good with the stimulator :) Just to give you guys an idea of cost, it was alittle over 300 for the V3 MS1 board (you could use v2.2 if you wanted) the stimulator (you dont need it, but i would get it) new GM coolant and IAT sensors, and whatever length of shielded wire it was that i got.
ballast, if you run megasquirt to control both fuel and spark you won't even have to worry about whether or not your stock ecu reacts well with it. All that obd2 has is a bunch of other bullshit emissions crap (The essentials to make a motor work do not change). I say go for megasquirt and spark extra. You get a boost controller, water or alcohol injector controller, all kinds other stuff. The megasquirt can/will control it all.
This next weekend i'm going to go to a few junkyards and try and get the parts for EDIS 4, and then order an accel coil pack and wires. I'm tempted to go straight to fuel and spark control. If i get a raise tomorrow i'm definately going to wait to put megasquirt on until i have everything for both fuel and spark, hopefully i dont get nervous and screw up like last time :evil:
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we haev obd2 plug in diagnostics in NC for all obd2 vehicles (96+) so all the fast cars here are 95 or older... which is ok but i want to build a "new" car when i graduate and that is impossible to do here... legally...
you guys shoot some pics when you get the setups together... i'd like to see how they come out.
what are your primary uses for the jeeps you're turbo'ing? street use mainly?
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The jeep is my only vehicle, so i guess you could say street use mainly. I'm not adding the turbo for offroad, i have no complaints about it's power down low. Just cruising and acceleration sucks. To be honest, if I couldn't do everything myself i most likely would not be doing it. But i've wasted a good amount of money on tools and want to use them lol. Especially since i have some stuff left over from my import days haha.
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Ill search the megasquirt forums later this week if I have time. I SHOULD be studying for my Calc final but just got done buying a 4.0 TB and spacer on ebay...
Ive been trying to determine what turbo to put on but havent quite figured out exactly what my specs are going to be. http://www.squirrelpf.com/turbocalc/ can you make any sense of this?
Heres my profile I think... http://www.squirrelpf.com/turbocalc/index.php?target_peak_power=190&engine_disp=151&target_af=12&bfsc=0.51&max_ic_loss=1.7&rpm_redline=5200&rpm_peak_power=5500&rpm_max_boost=3800&rpm_min_boost=1800&vol_1=89&vol_2=93&vol_3=90&vol_4=87&intemp_1=90&intemp_2=120&intemp_3=135&intemp_4=140&pre_company_id=1&pre_family_id=2&calc=yes&company=1&family=2&product=5calc=yes&
If you hit on produce graph at the bottom, It looks like a good match to me, I've only got it set for like 190hp and a max boost of like 6.7psi, dont really need 20psi on the engine. Maybe once I get a mild setup done and build a new motor I'll try for the wild setup.
Erik....My Jeeps a DD, my wife and I both had wranglers when we met, I traded the 6cl in for a Mazda and she drives that, I have inherited her 4cl automatic and finally after 3 years of driving it decided its still a damn Jeep and I'll bang her into shape. Don't offroad much yet. Once the kids are older it will be the family truckster so I have about 4 years to get her Florida trail ready, think all you need for that is some sunblock though!
I live in jacksonville and have to conquor the Dames Point every day so thats why I'm looking for HP.... http://www.mikestrong.com/dames/
Wouldn't be so bad if the damn autmatic wasnt reving 3200rpm at 70mph...
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i wish i could hit 70MPH
haha
out of curiosity, why are you choosing to turbo the 4 cyl auto instead of swapping in a sbc 350 with whatever tranny and tc you decided on? i realize that would be begging for axles but from my own experiences it would be more reliable....
just curious
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^ i wouldn't use that site. There is no way a straight to4e would be building boost under 2 grand on our motors, more like 4000rpm. How much power and how soon are you wanting to see some boost? also how much money are you wanting to spend? the new garrett GT series turbos are really nice, lots of people like the GT28RS.
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If Im not hitting that bridge at 80mph, I wont be going 50 when I crawl to the top, not good when semis are on your butt and the grandma next to you is passing you like your sitting still. When its windy, Im lucky to hit the top at 40.... seagulls pass me, I go so slow somedays, I get younger.
Why not as 350? Well, this is a DD, I would be hard pressed to swap in a 350 and a tranny in under 36 hours so I can make it to work again. Thats if I dont have school on any of those days. Thats if the wife doesnt mind watching both our kids (a 15 month old and a 2 month old) for 3 solid days while I sit in the garage and drink beer smoking cigarettes.
Granted I could overcome these obstacles but why? I can fiddle fart around with megasquirt or splitsecond before I even build a turbo to become familiar with it as well as eak a little more power out of the 1 lazy squirrel not holding his end up. I can buy a turbo at my leisure and the cheapest price, get the piping all fabed up without losing my ride and one day wake up and say "Its turbo time." and a couple hours later be tuning it. Meanwhile someone else throws their 4 banger on ebay for $100 and Ill pick it up to build int a better turbo machine. I could almost build 2 engines with turbos for the cost of a v8 swap and have 90% less hassle.
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^ just to let you know, you will most likely have downtime trying to turbo your jeep. Especially when its a DIY set-up... its trial and error in some cases.
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Id say boost at about 1800 rpm, need my auto to fully engage before I try and kill it. Power wise, I think I'd like to keep my 60k engine alive for at least 20 months so maybe a 30% increase to around 170. I guess as long as the boost isnt too overpowering, the HP wont be either? I know I saw a GT28 on ebay....
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Theres a difference in turbo install downtime and rip the whole front off and shoe horn a V8 in and hope it fires right up. If I buy spare parts (manifold etc) to fab off of, itll be a bolt in when Im ready to take a week off work and play with the install and tuning.
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be carefull. I'm pretty sure the gt28r is not a ball bearing turbo (or one of the gt28 series turbos). So you will get the much better GT series wheels, but not ball bearing chra. I'm not trying to burst your bubble, but boost at 1800rpm is going to be pretty hard to achieve. Now if you do run some form of spark control, you can play with the timing and fuel to help increase spool time. Also run an electronic boost controller. There are a few turbos that could let you start seeing boost around 2000rpm, but if you build up a motor later on and want to start putting out lots of power, dont expect to be building boost that low. So you are going to be fabricating everything yourself then correct? if so that helps with downtime.
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Ill be fabbing everything myself or at least directing some friends who can weld and mandrel bend. Im still a little ways out, want to do my 4.0 TB/spacer, and a new exhaust first so I can play with a splitsec or megasquirt. Would love to bump into a 2.5l engine for sale that isnt gonna cost a friggin grand although I thought about loking at those Titan engines and seeing if it has all the potential I needed. Once Im happy my engine can survive the experiment, Ill do some in depth turbo research.
What one do you plan on doing?
Expected Boost level?
Expected HP?
Any engine work to keep it all together?
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My expected power is going to be over 200whp, and whatever psi it takes to get there. The run down of the basic set-up i'm looking at now is:
Parts that are for sure/already have:
Megasquirt and spark using EDIS for ignition. (working on this obviously lol)
DSM 450CC injectors (Have access to a few sets)
DSM tdo5h 14b turbo with internal wastegate (I have this)
apexi twin chamber BOV (I have this)
Wideband O2 sensor (I have this)
Custom 3" stainless steel exaust (I have all the tubing/muffler/resonator on my integra right now, but am going to put it onto the jeep)
Custom 3" downpipe (Ordered a flange already)
4.0 HO throttle body and spacer (TB is on its way, spacer is sitting in the jeep)
Upgrading to a 3 core radiator.
Parts that i'm still contemplating:
Either an adjustable fuel pressure regulator, or fab up a way to use a 45psi or so regulator from another car. (most likely use something from another car to keep cost down)
I have not decided where i'm going to mount the turbo, so until i decide this i wont know how to design the manifold.
And since i dont know where i'm goign to put the turbo i dont know what size intercooler i can run or the placement of that.
I'd like to find some ARP headstuds or another brand like them.
Also i am going to find a second motor to have as a backup that i will rebuild and port the head on and possibly build a new intake manifold to get rid of the stock crap ass design. I'm just alittle worried about the damn power steering that mounts to it.
I'm going to be fabricating all of this myself :shock:
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if you contact ARP they will make any bolt if you provide them with specs... chances are they already have one made that's the correct size and strenth but labeled for something else considering they make a bazillion different nuts and bolts....
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^ thanks for the info. now all i need is a stock headbolt haha. Anyone know the specs by chance? Unless i can find a used block for cheap locally i won't have access to a set. I'm not going to pull the head on my daily just to get a bolt size. I'll just wait till i blow a headgasket and need to pull the head :lol: