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General Forums => The Mess Hall => Topic started by: 97 TJ - I dont wave on October 25, 2007, 08:21:46 PM
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:hitit:
The facts first:
97 TJ 2.5 liter
33x13.5 tires with 4.88 gears (4 inch lift)
magnaflow cat with maganflow muffler
K&N air filter
180 degree thermostat and the "Flow Kooler" water pump.
no mods to engine or computer.
148,000 miles, original owner.
It's also rhino lined, bumpers, winch and bla bla bla...
The Problem
I replaced the stock exhaust manifold due to a crack on the back side (facing engine).. I went to Napa and bought another manifiold which cracked in the same area 2 or so months down the road. I went and exhanged this one at Napa for another and it cracked in about 2 months again in the same spot. Frustrated I went a bought a Banks header. The Banks header cracked after 6-7 months down where the tubes all meet near the flange under the jeep. It cracked on a weld and also, if you looked inside the flange you could see small pinholes through the joints. I sent this one back to Banks and got my replacement. I put the replacement on in March of this year and this last week found it cracked again. one quarter of an inch of the weld at he flange blew out, this is the side of the flange that faces the engine again. I took off the header and looked inside through the lower flange and found, again, two small pinholes as well as the weld that blew out that I just described. I took the header over to my local muffler shop (one of the more respected ones here in Seattle). They said that it looked like the header was getting too hot and that is why it was cracking. They pointed out the discolored metal on the lower flange area. They did put a weld (temp fix) on the holes but say it will probably blow again because they think the metal has been weakend because of extreme heat. They refered me to a respected speed show in town to see if they could reflash the computer to get the exhause to run cooler. I went over to the speed shop and explained the issue and showed them the Banks header. They said that since my engine has NOT been modified (ie bored out, pistons, etc) and that I had 4.88 gear to compensate for the tires they didn't think that my exhaust should be a problem. They did say I could have a bad up stream oxygen sensor, but they could charge me an arm and a leg to let me know if I do. I said no thanks and left. On another note, my exhaust pipes are not binding or pulling in anyway on the header. Also, when I down shift I get rumbling/poping out of the exhaust, but it has always done this. I know Jeep exhaust manifolds have a reuptation for cracking, but why have I blown through 2 Banks headers? I spoke with a Banks Tech and they said they did not know either but they will gladly exhange my header again. I will hold out until the weld blows again I guess. Does anyone have any idea why this is happening??
Thanks....
RC
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Retarded ignition timing can cause the exhaust manifold getting to hot. I don't honestly know if a 2.5 has a timing chain but if it does would not hurt to check how much slop it has. Provided it has timing marks line those up take the distributor cap of and turn the cranckshaft back and fort to make the rotor move if it takes more than 10 degrees of crank rotation to move the rotor just barely back and forth the chain has to much slack atleast that is recommended for v8 engines should be the same for a line 6 or line 4 engine. However headers do have a tendency to run red hot especially when the engine revs fairly high on the highway and subsequently do not last all that long
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Do a plug check to see if #4 is running lean.
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I checked the timing chain today and there seems to be no play in comparison to the rotor rotation. I pulled all the plugs and they are all wearing the same and not of odd color. I am thinking of buying a new upstream O2 sensor and see if that does anything in the long run, thoughts????
:flush:
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The 2.5L has a rough idle. It's rougher then the 4.0L. I know of several instances where the 2.5L has broken off OBA brackets. It just fatigues them at the welds. This is why Kilby doesn't sell the older OBA kit anymore. My support bracket broke off and flew into the fan. Luckily, it dodn't damage anything else. I've also had exhaust hangers break off. In total, 3. It was worse when I had poly engine mounts since those transmit a lot more vibrations. That's one of the reason I went back to rubber mounts.
I'd look at all the hangers and see if you can free them up. What's happening is the engine is vibrating at a different rate then the exhaust and it's breaking at the Y. This is why many small I4's use flexible joint at the downpipe. It might be something to think about.
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:yikes:
Good points, I think I will try puting the stock motor mounts back in and buy the 1 inch spacers for them. My 1 inch motor lift spacers to create alot of vibration. I'll give that a shot... thank you :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick:
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:yikes:
Good points, I think I will try puting the stock motor mounts back in and buy the 1 inch spacers for them. My 1 inch motor lift spacers to create alot of vibration. I'll give that a shot... thank you :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick:
That's exactly what I ended up doing. I went with the JKS 1" spacers. I had a Currie 1" MML and a TDP 1" and still went back to stock and the spacers. You'll notice the torque difference when starting off the line. It's not as firm as you can feel the engine rock rather then you taking off.
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I am getting ready to put Banks header # 4 on. I have taken the Jeep to the dealer and they said the engine is running according to the manufacuters specifications and that all is well.. :stupid: I called Jet and asked them if their stage 2 would help cool the exhaust and received a "yes". The stage 2 chip is my next purchase and then I will send my 3rd cracked header back to get my 4th under their life time warranty. Oh, I also purchased a new Accel Performance Coil.. :stick:. Didn't help. So hopefully when I put on the Jet Chip it will help the 4th new Banks header. I also got rid of the lifted motor mounts and went back to the stock mounts with spacers.. This is killing me... One positive is that I can now replace a header in about an hour and a half.
:brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick: :brick:
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I know Jeep exhaust manifolds have a reuptation for cracking, but why have I blown through 2 Banks headers?
The 4.0L has that reputation, but not so much on the 2.5L, or at least I haven't heard of many.
I'll have two good OEM manifolds available once I get my Borla header on.
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why are you running it with the cooler t-stat and "high flow" pump? Engines have a designated operating range for peak thermal efficiency, messing with that (at least in the fuel injected age) will cause any number of unforseen troubles. Due to the cooler t-stat, your control system is probably running in "warm up" or "seek" mode constantly, with richer a/f mixes and a retarded timing. I can't say this is a direct relation to your header problem, but it might just be! Just as good measure, go buy the correct t-stat and put it in, it's one of the cheapest parts anyways.
If you're having overheating problems and that's why you've messed with the engine cooling, just get a better radiator. I know it's cheaper to get a thermostat rather than a radiator, but if you're not gonna do it right, don't do it at all...
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No, I bought the thermostat due to the future plan of installing the JET chip.
At this point I have not exchanged the header for the 4th one yet.
I have replaced the motor mounts and put my stock ones back in with 1 inch spacers, but that hasn't helped.
Like the dealer said, my engine runs just fine. I am at 165,000 miles now.
I almost wish it wasn't running so good so it would blow up. I think I could sell the HEMI swap at that point to my wife. :stfu: Either way, when I get the new header I will change both oxygen sensors, and put in the JET chip. I will update all after that. Now that I think of it, I have almost gone through as many Banks headers as I :bore:have windshields....
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Bought the Jet Chip Stage 2 and installed it. I still get rumble out of the exhaust when I let my foot off the gas and when shifting between gears (lean I assume). I will order the #4 next week and install it and see how it goes from there. If this chip doesn't work I have no idea what to do next...... 5.7 Hemi swap maybe? :english:
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I think Random has a valid point. The engine is designed to run at a certain temp for many reasons, and changing the t'stat to "help cooling" may well screw it all up. For what it's worth, I had a 180* in my '89 and noticed an improvement in performance and driveability when it went bad (after 4 mo...), and I replaced it with the 195* Jeep calls for.
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hey man what kind of plugs r u using because if your using anything other then champs your temp will go up causing the change in color hint craking your heads. i ran like 4 kinds of plugs in like a two month tryin to pass my smog CA/ now its a grows pol. get the O.E.M
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I would go back to the flex pipe idea as I've heard of that being the solution to prevent the 4.0l header from cracking. For $40 it can't hurt to try. I guess try to install it on the downpipe before the cat? - probly have to cut out part of the downpipe and then strap on the flex pipe. Anybody install one before and what location did you use? Also what is the diameter of the downpipe?
http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch.asp?N=700+4294923429+4294820497+115+4294814707
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I would go back to the flex pipe idea as I've heard of that being the solution to prevent the 4.0l header from cracking. For $40 it can't hurt to try. I guess try to install it on the downpipe before the cat? - probly have to cut out part of the downpipe and then strap on the flex pipe. Anybody install one before and what location did you use? Also what is the diameter of the downpipe?
http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch.asp?N=700+4294923429+4294820497+115+4294814707
When I re-did my exhaust last week, I installed a flex pipe before the cat to avoid any possible issues with cracking... I wanted to place it in the downpipe itself, but because of the O2 sensor, I could not. So far, I am happy with it.
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what size flex pipe did you end up using? Have a link to the specific one you used?
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what size flex pipe did you end up using? Have a link to the specific one you used?
No, I dont have the part number; I bought it at a local mufler shop (stainless steel, same diameter as the downpipe - 2.5 inches IIRC)
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Alright, the latest... I did not get the new header yet due to messing with a few more things first. I replaced the upstream and down stream sensors, and I am running oem plugs (tried them all, oem is the best) rotor andf cap are new. I ordered (from five 0) new injectors that are 22 pounds (like stock) but have 4 holes for better atomization. My harness also plugs right into them. They are the Ford blue (I'll get part # out later when I receive them -purchased today shipping today) I'll put in the new injectors, then replace the header with yet another Banks and hope for the best.
Having a flex tube is not the issue because you can clearly see the heat stress near the collector. The thermostat is not the issue because I had the problem before I even did that.
Once I have the new header on I will update again... This is getting expensive..
I will win this war.... Then when I figure it out, I'll trash the 4 banger for a 5.7 Hemi... I am on a quest!!! If I have to take a 2nd and 3rd out on this house I will figure it out.....
Thank you for all your input above, they are all valid points.
:yikes: :yikes: :yikes: :yikes: :yikes: :yikes:
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Also... I have never had any heating problems, I just put the flow cooler pump in "because" and the 180 thermastat due to the stage 2 Jet chip. I had the cracking problem before any of these mods...
By the way, the stage 2 jet chip gave me at least 3/4 of one horse power, great buy! Save your money and buy a microbrew and case of Arturo Fuente Cigars instead, your money will be better spent.
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Alright, injectors came in today. They are the dark orange Ford racing injectors # 0 280 156 013.
I will swap the injectors and header in the next few weeks...
:stfu:
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I would go back to the flex pipe idea as I've heard of that being the solution to prevent the 4.0l header from cracking. For $40 it can't hurt to try. I guess try to install it on the downpipe before the cat? - probly have to cut out part of the downpipe and then strap on the flex pipe. Anybody install one before and what location did you use? Also what is the diameter of the downpipe?
http://store.summitracing.com/egnsearch.asp?N=700+4294923429+4294820497+115+4294814707
I have a flex pipe before the cat, and no problems with cracked headers...
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Silly question. Anyone check or replace their cat? I had cracked exhaust manifold then I put a rebuilt motor in my Jeep with a Banks Header. It seemed about the same power as the motor before I changed it but not as powerful as when the jeep was newer. I had an issue with the Banks header mating to the stock exhaust (pre cat). I had a muffler guy change the flange on the stoc (pre cat) pipe. I was going to have him put flex in but he said it didn't need it. I also changed the cat to an aftermarket one and wham bam thank you ma'am, more power than I have ever experienced with my jeep before. It is not sports car but it gets up and goes now. Aside from a little overbore, Airraid intake and banks exhaust all else is stock. Anyhoo, I hate cats and I have had bad luck with them. Best investment I have made yet was replacing it.
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Silly question. Anyone check or replace their cat? I had cracked exhaust manifold then I put a rebuilt motor in my Jeep with a Banks Header. It seemed about the same power as the motor before I changed it but not as powerful as when the jeep was newer. I had an issue with the Banks header mating to the stock exhaust (pre cat). I had a muffler guy change the flange on the stoc (pre cat) pipe. I was going to have him put flex in but he said it didn't need it. I also changed the cat to an aftermarket one and wham bam thank you ma'am, more power than I have ever experienced with my jeep before. It is not sports car but it gets up and goes now. Aside from a little overbore, Airraid intake and banks exhaust all else is stock. Anyhoo, I hate cats and I have had bad luck with them. Best investment I have made yet was replacing it.
I replaced mine because it was blown out (you could literally see through it!), but no difference in perofmance when I installed the high flow one (except now the exhaust is a bit cleaner)
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BOSCH/Ford Racing (0280156013) injectors are installed. Runs alot smoother but I do not notice any horse power gain.
4th or is it 5th Gale Banks header is now in, thank god for the lifetime warranty. The one I sent back has the cracks in the exact same spots as the other Banks headers. Hopefully the injectors will atomize better and let the exhaust run cooler. If not I will be swapping another Banks header in 6 months. I did put in a new magna flow cat about 2 years ago. I am trying to download some pics but I am having a hard time.
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Also, I replaced the upstream and down stream oxygen sensors.... Just a shot in the dark.
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Here's one spot the Banks headers have cracked each time. Notice the color change at the collector versus the down tubes. This is due to the exhaust heat...
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Here is the money pit.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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The new vs old, with old being 6 to 8 months.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Here's one spot the Banks headers have cracked each time. Notice the color change at the collector versus the down tubes. This is due to the exhaust heat...
that is obviusly a design flaw - they should've figure it out by now and change it, can't believe they keep selling it that way. Thumbs down for Banks on that one
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Well the up side is I can swap out a header, start to finish, in an hour.
I think if this next one cracks I will ask for my money back (good luck) and try the Doug Thorley Tri-Y design.
I am still on a mission to sell the 5.7 hemi idea to the wife... I will get there.....some day.............
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that is obviusly a design flaw - they should've figure it out by now and change it, can't believe they keep selling it that way. Thumbs down for Banks on that one
The problem is they do not do long term testing and the I4 and I6 vibrates a lot. The 2.5L more so. Most companies don't do long term testing which is why many of them are breaking. Even the stock manifold aren't impervious to cracking in similar locations.
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My Jeep was one of 3 that Banks used to R&D the 2.5 header. It was down there for a couple of weeks. I don't think they took the stock manifold off. It took me over a year to recieve my free header. I left it in the box for over a year, I took it out only to take PICS to sell.
I had bad luck with headers in the past so I didn't want to mess around with them again.
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My Doug Thorley was put on almost 7 years ago,
Its never had a issue.
I've had to replace the rest of the exhaust system on my jeep
probably every 2 years since 1994, usually because
some part broke, mufflers, cats, hangers. I ran a
Inovate Diagnostic system on it for a couple days,
the fuel "curve" is way lean just off idle. I went through
3 stock manifolds before the Tr-Y went on. I've learned not
to run it low on fuel either, it can run super lean in a turn from
about 1/4 tank and down.
I still break off the rear manifold stud about once a year.
Its a Jeep thing :dance:
Dave
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My Doug Thorley was put on almost 7 years ago,
Its never had a issue.
I've had to replace the rest of the exhaust system on my jeep
probably every 2 years since 1994, usually because
some part broke, mufflers, cats, hangers. I ran a
Inovate Diagnostic system on it for a couple days,
the fuel "curve" is way lean just off idle. I went through
3 stock manifolds before the Tr-Y went on. I've learned not
to run it low on fuel either, it can run super lean in a turn from
about 1/4 tank and down.
I still break off the rear manifold stud about once a year.
Its a Jeep thing :dance:
Dave
Too bad Doug Thorley's Jeep headers are out of production.
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Ya, They went bankrupt at one point and are now owned by someone else I heard.
Didn't know they discontinued the header for the jeep though.
Maybe a stream of emails from the group would bring them back?
Dave
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Ya, They went bankrupt at one point and are now owned by someone else I heard.
Didn't know they discontinued the header for the jeep though.
Maybe a stream of emails from the group would bring them back?
Dave
I doubt that will help. Too few and on a discontinued engine. I'm like Scott and sticking with the stock manifold. I should replace the downpipe to route it around the oil pan instead of over it though.
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Dadgum, Guys.
I'm just getting ready to reassemble my motor with the Banks header (already paid for and lying on the floor by the TV here in my office) and now I'm getting REAL nervous.
Is this a widespread malady with Banks 4-popper Jeep header?
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Do worry about putting the banks on your new motor. The header has a lifetime warranty and after 2 years you will be able to swap headers in your sleep.
......The Glass Is Half Full.....
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I doubt that will help. Too few and on a discontinued engine. I'm like Scott and sticking with the stock manifold. I should replace the downpipe to route it around the oil pan instead of over it though.
Problem for me is that the Thorley so far is one of the best performance mods I have,
Switching from the stock to it was night and day on power and mileage, literally gave
me a gear back on a hill on my commute. Mainly in the torque department...
Besides, after buying 3 of the stock manifolds in 2 years....
If I had it to do over again I would season the manifold
thoroughly before installing.
( Heat the manifold up to 600+ and keep it there for a while then let it cool down slowly over several hours... )
My current pipe runs under the tranny just behind the bell-housing. I did see
one that ran down and around the front of the oil pan though. Which if there
was room to fit the cat up there would be sweet , should put less heat into the floor of the jeep.
I've been practicing, I'm going to build another header based on the
thorley design but with some changes ;)
Dave
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Don't worry about putting the banks on your new motor. The header has a lifetime warranty and after 2 years you will be able to swap headers in your sleep.
......The Glass Is Half Full.....
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Here comes # 6 boys, cracked again. It cracked right at the 6 month time frame. I have been driving it with a leak for the last month. I will take it off this next coming weekend (hopefully) and send it in for another. Appears to have cracked in the same spot the first FIVE did. I'll take pics next weekend.
I need to speed up my Hemi project so I don't have to fight this thing anymore. You would think the engineers at Banks would figure it out...
Aren't lifetime warranties great.
:beer:
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here is my .02 cents breaking exhaust manifolds yes you have heat and cooling also vibrations AND flexing OH hell of a mix of things at work here ! i use never seize on all bolts and flanges next exhaust spring washers from ford's 300 when i can -- the best way is to read the hows and whats on fasteners and washers ,springs also read about torque pattern and specs --if you figure ''8' tighten the bolts on your exhaust manfold and break the torque specs into 3 steps and wait 20 mins with each step. so steel or cast iron will seat evenly for a better seal -ok 15 fps wait 20 mins again 15 fps next 30 fps etc i know this is a pain but it works i learned this one from working on MB's for years still do! yes i drive a jeep !
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Been down that road too.
From injector swaps to power chips to everything else you can throw at it. Bottom line is I could have had a Hemi at this point.
Will not make the same mistake twice. With the combination of upgrades I have there is no way around this issue other than reprogramming the computer at this point. I am done.
I will string the 4 banger along till the Hemi is in. I may crack 2 more headers before then though... See my Hemi thread.
Working on piecing a Hemi swap now.
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You running poly engine mounts by any chance?
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Nope, I tired those 3 years ago and they transfered too much vibration.
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Did you get a replacement header each time or just fix the old one? If it really a problem then I'd think about using a flex pipe (a good one) and putting it in the down pipe. This is commonly done on most I4's these day's.
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I have received an exchange each time. It is truly a lifetime warranty. The vibration is not the issue. When you look at the pics you can really see the color change at the collector due to the extreme heat. It is getting so hot that the cracks form, and in a 2 cases some of the welds have popped off. In one case i blew the metal filler out of the center of the header where all the down tubes meet the collector. Fun stuff...
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I have received an exchange each time. It is truly a lifetime warranty. The vibration is not the issue. When you look at the pics you can really see the color change at the collector due to the extreme heat. It is getting so hot that the cracks form, and in a 2 cases some of the welds have popped off. In one case i blew the metal filler out of the center of the header where all the down tubes meet the collector. Fun stuff...
Well, I'd complain and try to get a refund.
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Not going to complain, just string it along until my project is done.
See my Hemi build thread.
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What gaskets are you using? NAPA specials or HI end like Remflex gaskets?
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Hi end, like Banks.
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Bought the Jet Chip Stage 2 and installed it. I still get rumble out of the exhaust when I let my foot off the gas and when shifting between gears (lean I assume). I will order the #4 next week and install it and see how it goes from there. If this chip doesn't work I have no idea what to do next...... 5.7 Hemi swap maybe? :english:
DO IT!!! :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow:
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Just swapped in #6... Rolling with banks header # 6 now. Still, Banks has no issue sending me a new header every 6-8 months. They could care less about the header I send back. I've asked for techs to call me and no one ever does. I am a hassle to them, it is easier to just give me a new header and move on with life. They do have great service, but I wish they would dig into their product, resolve the defect, and send me one that will never crack... Either way that's why I am moving on the to Hemi swap.
Here are pics of the old - you can see how the heat changes the collector colors and then eventually cracks just like the 5 before this one...
and the new....
[attachment deleted by admin]
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And where it cracked. aaagaaiinnnnnn.
[attachment deleted by admin]
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And the new header. take a good look this is the same spot the header cracks each time. You can compare this to the cracked picture above... yup, way too much heat yet Jeep says everything is running fine. Please don't throw any ideas out of how to fix this unless you read this entire blog. Tired of hearing the same thing over and over... No, it's not vibration... No, it has nothing to do with the thermostat, blah blah blah...
I can't wait to get my Hemi in.......
[attachment deleted by admin]
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Since the TJ is getting a Hemi, it doesn't really matter in this case. But the series of 3 breaks with the stock manifolds that occurred prior to the 6 Banks breaks -
"I replaced the stock exhaust manifold due to a crack on the back side (facing engine).. I went to Napa and bought another manifiold which cracked in the same area 2 or so months down the road. I went and exhanged this one at Napa for another and it cracked in about 2 months again in the same spot. Frustrated I went a bought a Banks header."
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tends to make me think something is out of line with TJ aside from the exhaust manifolds/headers.
It's anecdotal, but the same pos exhaust manifold has been on mine probably since late 1993 (purchased used in '99) and hasn't given out yet (I know the 4.0L and sometimes 2.5 manifolds are known to have problems though).
It said the TJ has 148k and I'm guessing it was bought in probably in '96 or '97. If it didn't have oem manifold breaks for the 10+ years prior to what it's been dealing with now, I'd personally be thinking (which is probably what you thought long ago): "what related to the TJ changed prior to the onset of the oem exhaust manifold breaks a few years ago?"
Anyway, may your Hemi swap not give you any problems like this TJ manifold/header biz :biggrin:
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Whats really odd is that it looks just like the shorty header for the V8 Engines,
and I've never seen one of them crack.... Its obviously something in the way
they crimp and weld it. Looks like the crack is very close to the crimp...
I went through a similar catch 22, I was going through a cat every 5K
shortly after I bought my jeep in 1994 brand new. The dealer insisted
there was nothing wrong with the motor and just kept changing the cat,
at 35K just before the warrantee was up I went into the dealer for another
rattling cat, they tried to blame it on my lift kit.... Long story short I got them
to put the new cat on and drove home and installed a new O2 sensor.
Last cat I had to replace till I smashed my exhaust and went to a all metal cat, 75K miles later.
Now I'm at 200K and counting...
Dave
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All this started in 2007, if you look at my first entry.
I am now at 184,000 miles.
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Yea, I was just commenting on how dealers/vendors etc do
seem to get missile lock and just ignore the real problem.
One of the nice things about the Thorley I have is no 4 into 1 collector.
Its 3 sets of 2 into 1 so there is way less bending to make the collectors.
Heck my header has over 100K on it. still solid as a rock. (Knock on wood...)
I do wonder if it would make any difference to normalize the whole assembly.
Bury it in charcoal briquettes light it and let it burn till it burns out.
Probably about 3 bags of Kingsford... But like ya say since the crack is
always in the same place it would likely not help. Its what they used to do
to welded tube frames for planes and such.... Its interesting as well to
me because I work on race cars with all kinds of custom exhausts
and I see welds crack but seldom the actual tubing, or collector.
Dave
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after seeing all them cracks ,MMM! this maybe off subject a bit but it bears to see things! the man who i work for had a hot copper water pipe crack open 14 days after ,he installed -it was at the seam joint ! it turns out who made the pipe ,it was brazed too cold and /or dirt in joint etc! stainless steel is very wild stuff ,getting it right is not easy -the heat of welding in drew out too much of the carbon or some else like poor alloying ! wow !!
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one thing is right the pipes are getting far to hot. but it appears that at the collector theres not enough room for the pipes to expand, so when they expand whats happening is there pushing out against the collector tube. effectivley creating enough pressure to crack the collector. a slightly larger collector pipe around the individual pipes would probably solve this problem. i've never cracked a manifold, my exhaust leak is because one of the manifold bolts has come completely out of the block. i would take a laser thermometer and check the exhuast temps after driving for awhile and see what it reads back, then figure out what it should be if it is off. its either a case of not enough fuel or too much fuel.
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I'm convinced it boils down (no pun) to Chrysler's clumsy fuel scheduling to make their CAFE numbers.
Their theory must have been, "If you can't FIGURE it out, just LEAN it out."
I had my Banks header Jet Hot coated because I knew it was going to crack anyway and I was looking for some kind of alternative to changing headers every six months.
I chose their sterling sliver ceramic as it's "good to" 1700 F, whatever "good to" means.
After about 3 hours of service, there was a crystalline layer all over the header and head pipe (had the head pipe done as well) that you could wipe off with your hand.
Yesterday, after nearly six months in service, Dan Groff from Jet Hot calls me out of the blue and asks me how it's going with their coating and the Banks header, so I ask him about the crystal-like deposits.
He said that ain't normal and wants to recoat at their expense under warranty, freight paid both ways. (Imagine that)
He and I both want to see if there's a cheaper way to prevent the Banks headers from cracking so he's motivated to help as he'd like to tap the Banks user market if there's a viable product here. (Cheaper than having the header rebuilt - I am NOT going to replace a header every six months just because Banks warrants them - got better things to do with my time.)
Frankly, I'm going to have the header and pipe recoated one more time and then I'll get rid of the junk Dodge Caravan motor and put an LS1 in its place.
Either way, I'm a "lifer" with Jet Hot coatings.
That sounded awfully much like a rant, didn't it?
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then I'll get rid of the junk Dodge Caravan motor and put an LS1 in its place.
The jeep amc 2.5 was never in a dodge caravan :fish: