4bangerjp.com
General Forums => The Mess Hall => Topic started by: melbill on April 29, 2009, 02:57:35 PM
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Does anyone have experience with Clifford Performance headers. Can anyone explain to me the intended and any real benefit to their style headers. The take the 4 tubes to 2 then bring them together into 1 pipe.
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My understanding is that the long tube headers (ie. clifford) will improve low end torque, while the short tube headers will improve high rpm HP. For a banger, low end torque is what you are looking for...
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I've got a set of Clifford headers on my 4banger, and, aside from price, I like'm! I feel they improve the low end torque, which on a trail Jeep in my situation is what counts the most. I still have good power and torque thruout the rpm range for the times I need to find out if the rev limiter works. The other mods on my banger include a Clifford cam and lifter set (pricey!), homemade throttlebody spacer, and work in the intake manifold to eliminate restrictions and sharp edges. I have a temporary "cold air" intake that will be replaced later on with a home made cowl intake. The short tube headers make good power higher up in the rpm range. That is useful to some folks and for the manufacturer gives them a better HP figure to advertise. Low and midrange torque is more important to daily driving and trail riding than top end HP. Somebody said that "Horsepower determines how fast you hit the wall; Torque determines how much of the wall you take with you..." In my mind, Torque figures mean more than HP.
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Agreed; power is torque X rotational speed, but how often can you really rev up to 5 or 6K RPMs when on the trail (especially for conquering obstacles)?
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Agreed; power is torque X rotational speed, but how often can you really rev up to 5 or 6K RPMs when on the trail (especially for conquering obstacles)?
:raisehand: :naughty:
TQ is where it's at.
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I was looking around for a place that sells these Clifford headers for the 4banger. Didn't find anything. You all know of retailers that carry them?
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I was looking around for a place that sells these Clifford headers for the 4banger. Didn't find anything. You all know of retailers that carry them?
I saw them at cliiford; but they are not cheap by any means...
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http://www.cliffordperformance.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CP&Product_Code=57-1000&Category_Code=J258
I was looking at $349 thinking: Ah that's too not to bad. But the extra $150 for the ceramic treatment does pad the price up a bit. Interesting clifford calls them shorty headers. Doesn't mention if they are stainless steel.
I'll probably get around to buying these or a borla or banks setup whenever the 15 year old, stock manifold cracks -- probably in about 2024 if I am lucky. :lol:
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http://www.cliffordperformance.net/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=CP&Product_Code=57-1000&Category_Code=J258
I was looking at $349 thinking: Ah that's too not to bad. But the extra $150 for the ceramic treatment does pad the price up a bit. Interesting clifford calls them shorty headers. Doesn't mention if they are stainless steel.
I'll probably get around to buying these or a borla or banks setup whenever the 15 year old, stock manifold cracks -- probably in about 2024 if I am lucky. :lol:
I am having a hard time finding the Borla ones... They have discontinued the support for the 4-banger it seems (quadratec told me that the cat back was discontinued, but I found it on 4wd.com and ordered it), and I have not found the headers yet...
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You should be able to find them at the smaller 4x4 retailers. This place apparently carries them: https://www.smsoffroad.com/products.asp?dept=46&pagenumber=1&sort_on=title&sort_by=DESC
On the subject of Borla, I personally think Borla should relocate to or at least open a design facility in Alaska. If their header designs survive in Juno across a heat range of 1000F down to -50F, then I'm theorizing they'll probably survive ok in Minnesota or Chicago or wherever else people end up ordering 3-4 replacements Borla headers due to repeated cracking (which I theorize is due to temperature-change related stresses). Unlike Alaska, Southern California's (and Florida's too probably) climate is just too easy on auto-parts which are ultimately sold to customers in harder climates. Of course, I still have heard of headers cracking in California too. Maybe Borla ought to integrate expansion joints in to the design or something then
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You should be able to find them at the smaller 4x4 retailers. This place apparently carries them: https://www.smsoffroad.com/products.asp?dept=46&pagenumber=1&sort_on=title&sort_by=DESC
On the subject of Borla, I personally think Borla should relocate to or at least open a design facility in Alaska. If their header designs survive in Juno across a heat range of 1000F down to -50F, then I'm theorizing they'll probably survive ok in Minnesota or Chicago or wherever else people end up ordering 3-4 replacements Borla headers due to repeated cracking (which I theorize is due to temperature-change related stresses). Unlike Alaska, Southern California's (and Florida's too probably) climate is just too easy on auto-parts which are ultimately sold to customers in harder climates. Of course, I still have heard of headers cracking in California too. Maybe Borla ought to integrate expansion joints in to the design or something then
They do have them, but they ask $580 for them (when the MSRP is $390! And they have the brains to publish the MSRP!!!)
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I figured it was going to be one of those deals like: "Not our regular price of $390, but on special for $340 + shipping."
$580! Who said you can't price-gouge online? :lol: Sorry about that link Felipe. There's probably a bunch of other small shops out there with them in stock and for a more reasonable price.
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I figured it was going to be one of those deals like: "Not our regular price of $390, but on special for $340 + shipping."
$580! Who said you can't price-gouge online? :lol: Sorry about that link Felipe. There's probably a bunch of other small shops out there with them in stock and for a more reasonable price.
It IS possible that they listed the wrong price, so maybe you should call and find out...
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It IS possible that they listed the wrong price, so maybe you should call and find out...
I'll get right on that :lol:
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does anyone know if clifford makes a header for a 2000 jeep wrangler? the only header i can find made by them says it will fit 84-96. i was having trouble finding a full length header for my year.
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The difference is mostly in the routing of the pipe and you have to build your own crossover pipe.