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General Forums => The Mess Hall => Topic started by: drunkencityworker on March 08, 2010, 07:36:37 PM
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Great Lakes Jeep Thing's beloved Jeep CJ grill, 'Bubba' has been sold out from under the club and we would like help tracking it down so we can attempt to buy it back from who ever Erik (OOC) has sold it to.
Long story short the grill was built from donations by the members of GLJT for the club and has been a fixture at club events for the last several years. The member who stored it and had it titled to them sold it off this weekend (we think it was this weekend) without any notice to the club or it's members. Needless to say the club is both heart broken and angry; our members put countless hours into that grill and are all upset to hear that not only is it gone but it was sold without us even having a chance to purchase it back.
For the record the member who stored it had never complained about the finacial burden or ask for somebody else to take over duties even when it was offered on several occasions.
We, obviously, bear no ill will towards the person who purchased Bubba, it is a great grill that any Jeep club or enthusiast would be happy to own and how could they know things where not on the up and up, they took Erik at his word that the whole thing was a legit deal.
If you have Bubba or know who does we would like it if you could get in contact with us regarding purchasing the grill back if possible. We know it is a lot to ask, Bubba is a rare treasure and if I had it I would nto want to give it up either but the people who really own it never had a say in it's sale.
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http://i975.photobucket.com/albums/ae233/drunkencityworker/4418093742_aa505073e3_o.jpg
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(http://i975.photobucket.com/albums/ae233/drunkencityworker/4418093742_aa505073e3_o.jpg)
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thats sweet man
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Contact x-zr2@hotmail.com or if it's easier call Brandon at (773) 316-3072 if you have any info.
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So the guy sold what he knew was not his? That's pretty low. Hope it finds it's way home.
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that bites
you guys should take him to small claims court - if you have anything to prove that was a club thing (emails, receipts, pictures of build and of course witnesses) you could claim something like $9k or $10k or whatever the limit is in the jurisdiction - he might be willing to facilitate having it bought back once he sees that on the role.
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What an a :asshat:! Good luck getting it back.
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looks like building a new one will be cheaper than lawyers
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looks like building a new one will be cheaper than lawyers
Well that is a bummer!
Do a build thread if a new one is built. Would love to see it take shape!
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looks like building a new one will be cheaper than lawyers
that's the point, you don't need a lawyer for small claims court.
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I sincerely hope that Bubba returns.
Is Erik still a member?
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looks like building a new one will be cheaper than lawyers
I would honestly look into small claims court. Especially if your club can prove that it was the clubs and he was only storing it. Small claims will range anywhere from $3000 to $15000 and you represent yourself so no layers.
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you guys should take him to small claims court - if you have anything to prove that was a club thing (emails, receipts, pictures of build and of course witnesses) you could claim something like $9k or $10k or whatever the limit is in the jurisdiction - he might be willing to facilitate having it bought back once he sees that on the role.
I would honestly look into small claims court. Especially if your club can prove that it was the clubs and he was only storing it. Small claims will range anywhere from $3000 to $15000 and you represent yourself so no layers.
Unfortunately the grill was titled to Erik (according to the original post.) Legally this means he can do whatever the hell he wants with it, whether it's a priceless club heirloom or not. All he would have to do is present proof of ownership (i.e. copy of title, notorized bill of sale, whatever) and the courts would automatically rule in his favor. I know it sucks, but it's the law. Unless you find the person who bought the grill and s/he's willing to sell it back, you might as well start on another one.
Sorry I have to be the bearer of bad news :'( For what it's worth, I think what he did was extremely low.
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Unfortunately the grill was titled to Erik (according to the original post.) Legally this means he can do whatever the hell he wants with it, whether it's a priceless club heirloom or not. All he would have to do is present proof of ownership (i.e. copy of title, notorized bill of sale, whatever) and the courts would automatically rule in his favor. I know it sucks, but it's the law. Unless you find the person who bought the grill and s/he's willing to sell it back, you might as well start on another one.
Sorry I have to be the bearer of bad news :'( For what it's worth, I think what he did was extremely low.
actually you're wrong.
the only instance you are correct is if it was his to begin with but even in that case if he expressed that he gives it to the club and on that account everyone else chipped in with work, money, parts, materials and such it can be still ruled that at that point it was a joint ownership. If you bring in witnesses and evidence doesn't matter who's name is registered under at the DMV.
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actually you're wrong.
the only instance you are correct is if it was his to begin with but even in that case if he expressed that he gives it to the club and on that account everyone else chipped in with work, money, parts, materials and such it can be still ruled that at that point it was a joint ownership. If you bring in witnesses and evidence doesn't matter who's name is registered under at the DMV.
It may seem that way in theory, but in practice, I've seen it happen in similar situations a few times. In practice, official documents tend to be more influential in court than witnesses and circumstantial evidence.
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You title a grill? Also, I would think that those who gave time and parts to the grill under the pretense of it being the clubs could file against the sale.
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You title a grill? Also, I would think that those who gave time and parts to the grill under the pretense of it being the clubs could file against the sale.
by the way it looks it was built like a trailer so that needs to be registered (i assume it was towed to location) - but drunkencityworker can clarify that
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You title a grill? Also, I would think that those who gave time and parts to the grill under the pretense of it being the clubs could file against the sale.
Depends. In the original post he said it was titled to this Erik douchebag. It looks like a trailer, and in this state at least, you have to register those. I used to have a home-built pig smoker that was built like a trailer with a tongue and axle, and it required a tag and title because it can be pulled by another vehicle. If this is the case, the title or registration would take precedent. All the guy would have to say is that the club gave him the grill and present a copy of a title, registration, or other official proof of ownership. Since the grill was "given" and no money exchanged hands it would require no bill of sale. At that point it would just be the club's word against his, except he would actually have official documentation to back his side of the story. The proof of ownership would outrank any witnesses because it's an official document. I'm not saying that they won't win -- you never know how a judge is going to rule. I'm just saying that the odds are stacked against them unless the guy that sold the grill is a complete idiot and didn't keep any copies of his paperwork.
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OK, I see the plate now. So it had to be registered in someone's name. Still, it's a bit shady to have people build it under the pretense that it's the 'clubs'. Even if it's titled under someone elses name. Those people were donating their time, parts and services to the club not the title holder. In which case, they should be able to collect. At worst case, he would have to split whatever he took in from the sale.
In any case it's just a fancy gas grill. Now if it was a wood smoker... ;) :drink:
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OK, I see the plate now. So it had to be registered in someone's name. Still, it's a bit shady to have people build it under the pretense that it's the 'clubs'. Even if it's titled under someone elses name. Those people were donating their time, parts and services to the club not the title holder. In which case, they should be able to collect. At worst case, he would have to split whatever he took in from the sale.
In any case it's just a fancy gas grill. Now if it was a wood smoker... ;) :drink:
Don't get me wrong, I totally agree with you. The guy that sold it is a shady bastid and should be beaten liberally. The problem is that the law sucks and there are loopholes to weigh it in your favor, and in this case, the douchebag has the golden scale (unless he's a complete idiot, like I said previously.)
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Don't get me wrong, I totally agree with you. The guy that sold it is a shady bastid and should be beaten liberally. The problem is that the law sucks and there are loopholes to weigh it in your favor, and in this case, the douchebag has the golden scale (unless he's a complete idiot, like I said previously.)
if 10 pple from the club show up in court as witnesses and you have some pics to prove the work that was done it would be up to the judge to decide. worst case scenario he will have to come up with some money to compensate for part of the item which is still for the judge to decide. A contract between 2 parties can be written or can be a verbal agreement - on his part has deceived the other party (the club and it's members) and lead them to believe that the agreement is that the grill was the for the club and so it was built/restored by a collective effort based on that understanding (verbal contract). Again, it is up for the judge to decide and make a ruling including compensation, if it was me and these were the facts i would go for it just to prove a point and on top of that might come up with something in the end.
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In Illinois trailors need a plate.
He texted that it was going to somewhere in wisconsin. Not sure what courts could do with state lines being crossed. And he could say he sold it for $1 and theres no money to recover.
There are screenshots of forum arguments where he admitted on the forum that the grill was not his to sell.
Erik/OOC has still has members privledges so that he could read what an incredible selfish prickmo he is. It gets pretty ram over in the members section. lol.
The mods can see when and where he goes. And yes the next day he did read what everyone says about him. I am fairly sure there is some illegal harassment going on since someone listed his cell ,home, and work numbers.
Personally I am trying to look at the bright side of things. I just got voted into club so I am fairly new. But he has done some shady stuff such as spotting peoples rigs into severe damage such as hydo lock and worse. If bubba was the cost to loose an asshat like that then the club is better off. Plus now we have a reason to get together a bit more often. Bubba 2. There is a possible yj that may be the next donor.
It is everywhere what a douch this guy is and well hope he just gives up this hobby cause I for one wont be wheeling with him.
Thanks for all posts and concerns guys. Will keep ya posted
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Hopefully the club learned its lesson and titles the next trailer in the name of the club (I'm assuming that the club is incorporated in some fashion).
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If there was a known history then they should have outed him well before anything major happened. The guy is a jerk and vindictive at that. I would doubt that he sold it for $1 though. Personally, I wouldn't give the guy any privileges since that's exactly what he's looking for. He's probably laughing about it.
If your club were to take the guy to court, the judge will ask to see a bill of sale which should have the name of the buyer on it. If it's found that the trailer wasn't the guy's to sell then it would be considered stolen property. This doesn't mean the club would get it back as jurisdiction ends at the state line. But it would be entered into the database and could be picked up if someone sees it. Lots of if's though. The trailer is pretty unique though so I think the chance of recovery might be higher then average.
I think it would be tough to build a CJ grill as there aren't that many CJ's around. Even YJ's are pretty rare. Might have to make it a TJ. :lol:
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I work in the judicial system and both of those guys are right. The judge could lean one way or another with the thing being titled, as well as a court house full of witnesses.
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I work in the judicial system and both of those guys are right. The judge could lean one way or another with the thing being titled, as well as a court house full of witnesses.
yeah, if you can prove your case it can go either way - it's still worth a shot imo, even to make him uncomfortable if nothing else.
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even to make him uncomfortable if nothing else.
As I understand it, that has been well taken care of.
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Because we are so close by, someone from my club posted the pic in our forum....we're now looking at making something like this as well for the Two Trackers.... :clap:
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gl4x4..right?
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gl4x4..right?
yep...somebody saw it on there and then posted the pic on our private forum.
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There classifieds are great...makes me wish I had money..lol
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did you find it?
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nope didnt find it...a club member is buying 3yjs. One is a burn victim and will be the new donor
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any updates on this?
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no ???
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wow that is unbelievable, or i wish it was, but these days i have seen and can believe someone would do it. im sure he says he sold it for 1 dollar and if you found the dmv slip it probably says it too cause if he was smart hed tell the buyer hed say that to cut a break on taxes but also not show he made the money. i cant believe that he would purposely guide people into trouble. i try to be calm but if someone purposely guided me into trouble for his own amusement, im not sure what i might do for mine..... :guns: well at least he made himself out before he got someone hurt that doesnt know better than to trust him and im sure youll all have fun building the next one :beers:
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any luck?
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Man, that guy was an :asshat: