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General Forums => The Mess Hall => Topic started by: lilftballpunk on June 08, 2010, 10:40:48 AM
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Im in the process of completely rebuilding my 2.5L. And I was wondering if anyone out there has done the same or came across performance crank, rods and pistons. I just want to build one helluva 4cyl motor. And shut down some v8 mustangs along the way. Anyone with ideas?
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You could add Yella Terra rocker arms. Both Avenger and Yella Terra make superchargers. I believe one memeber here has done a complete machine shop rebuild of his 2.5.
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I have done much research one the top end. From a cam, to intake and exhaust. I just can't really come to find anything as far as a crank and pistons. That's my main focus. As well as a (if possible) aluminum head...
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IIRC there are some Chevy pistons that would work. I don't remember which ones off hand though. Not much in the crank department other then the Mopar Performance but I don't know anyone who bought one and they are long since available. I do know a guy who had his crank modified to make a stroker out of it. It's all custom work though.
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IMO you can build the 2.5 until your pockets are empty and you are deep into debt. Your still not going to shut down some V8 Mustangs! The 2.5 is a good little motor but it's no power house VS. a V8 or other motors of it's size.
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X2
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It is not what you can do to a 2.5l block, crank, rods, and pistons. You can take all that and redo its entire design to get a better motor. But then, why? Cost to benefit ratio is not there. That is a major cause for not having a 'kit' readily and commercially available. No one has spent their r&d money into such a thing.
I question your enthusiam about shutting down v8 Mustangs. Its a Jeep vs Mustang. They are not the same in any way, shape or form. If you really need and want to shut up a Mustang, spend your money on a new Camaro or Challenger. Lots of bolt on products out there in the aftermarket to make each one compete. Why not take a Mustang V8/trans and toss that into your Jeep. Upgrade the rear axle, replace 4wd with 2wd (remove front 4wd axle for a straight 2wd drive tube axle), and go shut them down that way.
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Just get you a diesel truck and shut the mustangs down one at a time
http://www.youtube.com/v/CE4SLTwmEeU&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xd0d0d0&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&fs=1
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I question your enthusiam about shutting down v8 Mustangs. Its a Jeep vs Mustang. They are not the same in any way, shape or form. If you really need and want to shut up a Mustang, spend your money on a new Camaro or Challenger. Lots of bolt on products out there in the aftermarket to make each one compete. Why not take a Mustang V8/trans and toss that into your Jeep. Upgrade the rear axle, replace 4wd with 2wd (remove front 4wd axle for a straight 2wd drive tube axle), and go shut them down that way.
Yeah Scott, what's up with that? :wall:
Honestly though, I could care less about beating a Mustang. It's keeping up with the Geo Metro's on the Highway that's the problem. :lol:
Yes, it's going to be cheaper to do an engine swap then to custom build the 2.5L into what amounts to a race engine. Although, you could just settle on a Turbo or Supercharger and call it good. That would also be cheaper then doing a bunch of custom internal work.
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Ok, I understand that it wouldn't and doesn't make since to put so much money into a 4cyl. However i'm one to prove others wrong in a sense that anything is possible. I have done much reserch on this engine. Every post I have ever came across someone has said to just drop in a v8. But with the money you will spend doing the swap is simply not worth it to me. I already have a big truck with much power. I just want to make the best out of what I have now. Anyone can just go bigger and better. But i'm not everyone, I tend to do things the hard way. And hey I might not be satisfied afterwards. But at least I can say I tried and failed then say I never tried at all.
So with all that said, I simply want to know the best way to go relating to my 2.5L. Not anything bout v8's or anything of that such cause I simply already know.
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Ok, I understand that it wouldn't and doesn't make since to put so much money into a 4cyl. However i'm one to prove others wrong in a sense that anything is possible. I have done much reserch on this engine. Every post I have ever came across someone has said to just drop in a v8. But with the money you will spend doing the swap is simply not worth it to me. I already have a big truck with much power. I just want to make the best out of what I have now. Anyone can just go bigger and better. But i'm not everyone, I tend to do things the hard way. And hey I might not be satisfied afterwards. But at least I can say I tried and failed then say I never tried at all.
So with all that said, I simply want to know the best way to go relating to my 2.5L. Not anything bout v8's or anything of that such cause I simply already know.
I hear what your saying. I like to work with what I have too. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it does not. It all depends on how you want to use your Jeep. I am not a expert on building motors including the 2.5. There is some upgrades avail for it that do help get down the freeway better or stay in 4th or 5th gear while climbing a hill on the freeway.
If you search around on the board you will find people doing 62-64mm TB swaps,grinding the intake opening to match, E-fan,headers,cam shaft and roller rockers,cat back,adjustable fuel pressure regulators, 19# mustang injectors, cold air intakes,bore the cyl .60 over. All of these things add a little power, added up they amount to more HP and TQ. The biggie upgrades are supercharger or turbo.
Jeffy, I guess I'm just a hater :twofingers: :blbl: :lol:
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For sure, my 4banger regularly gets dusted by geo metros, smart cars, lady's garden-club packed minivans, and 25 year old Corollas that look like they've had 12 owners, 750k miles on OD.
If you can do all that internal engine work successfully and fairly inexpensively on the 4Banger, give it a go. It be interesting to hear about.
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I had my engine pro built with Hesco parts and the builder is way above average (I have a racing addiction that he enables...)
It cost m2 about $2300 for parts and his work for a full b&B and a very tight assembly job, degreed cam etc.
II got a bit of a deal on the labor, I've helped him out several times as well...
I can pull 85 MPH on the freeway, and I can pull freeway hills in 5th until I get over about 6000 ft.
I did the pull and replace on the motor.
Just a benchmark to compare to.
Dave
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I had my engine pro built with Hesco parts and the builder is way above average (I have a racing addiction that he enables...)
It cost m2 about $2300 for parts and his work for a full b&B and a very tight assembly job, degreed cam etc.
II got a bit of a deal on the labor, I've helped him out several times as well...
I can pull 85 MPH on the freeway, and I can pull freeway hills in 5th until I get over about 6000 ft.
I did the pull and replace on the motor.
Just a benchmark to compare to.
Dave
I need to find an engine builder like yours, Dave, and then find a way to save the dude's life :biggrin:
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I had one built by 505 performance, it has ross racing pistons and rods, bored and balanced crank, cam, shaved head, port polish, valve job, roller rockers, and the compression is dropped cause its a turbo motor but he tells me it will hold up to about 15 pounds of boost for daily driving and should be close to 450hp but we will see i still am working on it. but it can be done
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I had one built by 505 performance, it has ross racing pistons and rods, bored and balanced crank, cam, shaved head, port polish, valve job, roller rockers, and the compression is dropped cause its a turbo motor but he tells me it will hold up to about 15 pounds of boost for daily driving and should be close to 450hp but we will see i still am working on it. but it can be done
4 cyl 2.5L with 15psi of boost = 450HP? or a 4.0?
what compression did they set it for?
EDIT: i ran the MSD calculator and this is what it came to on the 150cu.in./2.5L for 450HP at the crank
BSFC: put it at 0.57 since it's a turbo
87% VE (for the rpm below i think it's a fair guestimate)
AFR: 12
boost:15psi
inlet air temp: 70F
intercooler efficiency: 70%
CFM: 715
injectors (4): 72lb/hr
required RPM: 10,000 => 458HP
so it is possible if you can spin it to 10k rpm.
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I honestly dont know what the compression is but i know from what he tells me it should run pretty good, and the 450# thats from him but i know it will spank most 4.0's
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I'm sure if 505 build it will be a monster, just dunno with the hydraulic flat tappet cam if you can spin it that high, can't see it making that power at 6000 rpm (doesn't add up as far as CFM requirement to generate that amount of power) - i ran the same calculations for 6000 rpm and put in 100% VE (just to see what comes to, not real world), the calculated HP at the crank is 316, at 7000 rpm is 369HP and at 8000 is 421. If you drop the VE to 95 for example then you get 300/350/400 at 6/7/8000 rpm. I'd really be interested to see how much it makes though, sounds like a great build - any pics of it yet? or did they give you a list of parts with part numbers they used, that would be great if you can post them just for reference.
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I'm all for this! From the moment i got the 4banger all my jeep buddies have been telling me to swap out the 4cyl for the 6 or "throw a v8 in there" My response is...everyone does that. all their suggestions did was harden my resolve to build a badass 4cyl jeep once i had the money. Recently ive been leaning towards a 4cyl diesel swap..it'll still be a diesel lol. But when the time comes to choose, it will be between building up the current engine till it spanks the 6cyls or getting a 4cyl diesel that also spanks the 6cyls. Anyway, i can see where you're coming from on this.
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i wanted to do the 4bt cause im all about doing somthing differant, but im only 20 and my wallet told me to stay with what i had already, so i decided to build it to the max, ill try to take pics tomarrow cause it should be running by then, and since i dont have a dyno near by i doubt i will dyno it in the near future, but from what zak tells me it will be badazz, but ill keep you posted he has only built three of these motors so i have to play with injectors, and make a fuel map. But man i am excited.
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i wanted to do the 4bt cause im all about doing somthing differant, but im only 20 and my wallet told me to stay with what i had already, so i decided to build it to the max, ill try to take pics tomarrow cause it should be running by then, and since i dont have a dyno near by i doubt i will dyno it in the near future, but from what zak tells me it will be badazz, but ill keep you posted he has only built three of these motors so i have to play with injectors, and make a fuel map. But man i am excited.
4BT isn't 'different'. It's actually a fairly common swap.
I know 505 Performance did the turbo swap in Pete Trasborg's 2.5L.
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I finally got it running it runs pretty good timing is still a little off but ill keep you updated.
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I need some advice i got the exhaust done today, but it sounded terrible so i took it home and pulled the plugs and the first three looked good then i got to the back one and it was like the cylinder was dead, so i replaced the plugs and all the wires, but still the same thing the only other thing i can think of is the injector isnt squirting enough fuel or a flat lobe of the cam. Any Ideas i need some help on this one. thanks