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General Forums => The Mess Hall => Topic started by: N8whitie on October 12, 2010, 10:17:03 PM
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So I'm driving home today going through Hayward, make a left turn down Campus Dr and SNAP! WAP! WAP! WAP! I stopped immediately and got out, crawled under my rig to see a broken output shaft. I had to get it towed home. I guess tomorrow I'm going to get an SYE like I should have done in the first place. I love it, as soon as I fix one thing another breaks immediately after.
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Did it take out the rear tail cone? If not you can get a new output shaft for a quick fix. $12. A SYE is a good idea though. Still, I haven't run one...
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N8, you got the 4.5'' lift if i'm not mistaking, did you get a t-case lowering kit with it? if not that's why it broke, the slip yoke won't slip at that angle, more pull on the output shaft - so you'll either need the SYE or a t-case lowering kit.
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N8, you got the 4.5'' lift if i'm not mistaking, did you get a t-case lowering kit with it? if not that's why it broke, the slip yoke won't slip at that angle, more pull on the output shaft - so you'll either need the SYE or a t-case lowering kit.
You can see some spacers in one of his pics.
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The cone is fine, i caught the breakage the second it happened so I stopped to prevent anymore damage. I think I'm goint to pick up an SYE today and throw it in. The jeep had the T case lowering kit from the previous guys lift.
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What actually broke? Was it the drive shaft or something internal to the transfer case?
Either way, an SYE along with a CV driveshaft is good to have.
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You can see some spacers in one of his pics.
didn't notice, SYE then and call it done.
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Why not just remove the shaft and drive home in front wheel drive??
My driveshaft ujoint was ready to fail and I drove around like that for a couple of days.
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Why not just remove the shaft and drive home in front wheel drive??
My driveshaft ujoint was ready to fail and I drove around like that for a couple of days.
with YJs the d/s slip yoke is the one that seals the t-case from losing the fluid, would spill out if the d/s is removed.
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with YJs the d/s slip yoke is the one that seals the t-case from losing the fluid, would spill out if the d/s is removed.
That's a VERY good reason.... :wave:
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From what I have heard a Gatoraid cap is a good fit to stop the fluid from leaking out of a 231 with the driveshaft removed. A bit of duct tape to hold it in place.
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Its strange that I didn't have problems with the previous lift then as soon as I change it I get problems. I did notice that the shims were a bit smaller than the shims on the stock springs. I also notice another thing and its that the skinny part of the shim was pointing forwards on the previous and the BDS kit told me to put the fat part pointing forward.
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There shouldn't have been shims on there at all but with those shackles the PO had to dial back the pinion angle so it wasn't pointing straight up. The new shims were needed to point the pinion up a bit to get rid of some of the angle.
It breaking when it did, doesn't mean it was the lifts fault. It could have happened prior but changing it caused it to break.
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Yeah, that thought was in the bak of my head but just wasn't sure. OK, I'm looking at ordering the Heavy Duty SYE kit for the NP231 from Advanced Adapters. Am I going to need a new ear rdriveshaft as well? Im reading the page here and thats what it sounds like.
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Just called Tom Woods and my SYE and rear double cardan DS is on the way. Whole thing cost me 530 in total but I figure i might as well go with top quality if I'm replacing things now.
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When you get the new shaft you'll have to rotate your pinion up so it's more inline minus 2-3*.
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Thats what Josh at Tom Woods said too so I'll get that done. I took some pics to show you guys what I see here. Now to me it looks like the cone on the tranfercase where the shaft goes in is about 3 inches or so to the left of where the pinion comes out of the differential. Is it possible the Tcase shifted over?
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/n8whitie/action075.jpg)
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/n8whitie/action076.jpg)
In this pic you can really see where it looks off.
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/n8whitie/action076.jpg)
I put two screwdrivers on the deck.. one is directly under the rear cone of the Tcase where the shaft goes in and the other is directly under where it comes out of the dif.
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/n8whitie/action079.jpg)
I looked at the front drive shaft coming back and it looked plenty straight to me.
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Something has shifted, that driveshaft should be pretty straight if the rear axle is original.
What makes you think the tailshaft broke? BTW, the tailshaft is part of the mainshaft all the way through the transfer case, it's all one piece.
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Something has shifted, that driveshaft should be pretty straight if the rear axle is original.
What makes you think the tailshaft broke? BTW, the tailshaft is part of the mainshaft all the way through the transfer case, it's all one piece.
Do you think the Tcase shifted? Have you ever heard of that happening?
I figured it broke because of the noise it made. Definitely sounded like a snap. If that isn't the problem its ok because I needed an SYE anyways but I you may be right. I guess I'm not 100% sure that its broken. My new Shaft and SYE gets here on Monday so I'll see then. Also, I'm taking my Tcase spacers off.
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Check to see if the t-case has it's mounting hardware still and if it's loose or not. Also check the motor mounts. Looks like the drivetrain has shifted.
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Thanks man. I'll check the motor mounts and the Tcase mounting hardware tomorrow. I had it towed to my moms because she has a garage and I don't so when I go there'll look.
I wonder if something came loose when I took the body lift off? I seriously have no idea what would have caused it.
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was there tcase shift lengthening hardware that you didnt remove, it couldve just popped into neutral. i had that happen to me in my tj i was do 70 down the highway and on the tj the linkage mounts to the body, its the stupidest design ever but a rubber boot tore and it popped into neutral. just food for thought. you could jack up the rear of the jeep and try spining the rear d shaft if the shaft is broke it would feel funky spinning.
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that is way off, should be centered, like they ^ said something to do with the mount - my guess is the bolts came out (the ones that go in the transmission).
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Looks like the tranny mount broke.
Your pinion is already pointed WAY up, too far up for a standard driveshaft but it should be really close to correct once the SYE is installed.
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I talked to Josh at Tom Woods today about that pinion angle and he said that it would be good once I take the Tcase drop off and the SYE is in as well. The shims are aluminum and you guys had mentioned previously that they can crack so I will eventually take them off and reweld the perches when I find a good price on a welder. You also asked a question on how I know if the shaft is in fact broken and forgot to include that when I grab it and try to move it, it has some play where it goes into the Tcase, like its loose or something. Is that normal? I have this Friday off so I'm going to go through the under carriage and check all of the mounting hardware as well as the motor mounts.
It seems like between this jeep undergoing upgrades, breaking and talking with you guys I'm going to be a master jeep mechanic alot quicker than I thought. Ha! I appreciate all of the help and advice from you guys. As soon as this jeep is dialed enough I would love to go hit a trail and I'll spring for a few adult beverages afterwards.
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The noise you heard was probably the transfer case flopping around. It definately looks like it shifted and the driveshaft and tail cone look OK. Your transmission mount must be broken for it to shift that much. Unless it wasn't even bolted down.
You can buy a complete mount set with motor mounts for $35.
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OK cool. Looks like I'm getting a new DS and SYE anyways so that will be going in along with the new mount set up.
Question, How do or what would cause the mounts to break? I was just driving on a surfaced road, not a trail. Maybe just wear and tear over the years?
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unless you're missing the anti-torque bolt i don't think the mount is broken, if it was that bolt would still keep the transmission lined up (the bracket that the bolt goes thru is held in by the 2 mount bolts to the transmission). take some pics, i still think the bolts came lose or got stripped out of the mounting holes to have the t-case shift that much. I'm really curious to see what actually happened - if you take a pic above the trans skid you should be able to see what happened ( peak or pic - you pick :lol: )
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They could go out a few different ways. The bolts fatigued and they sheared off. If the bolts get loose the rocking could shear the bolts. OR the rubber rotted away... Look into the skidplate where the transmission mounts to the skid. You should have three bolts.Two are for the mount and one which helps reduce any torquing from the drivetrain.
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OK, I'll go to my moms and get some pics tomorrow after work. I wish I had a garage, I would go take them right now. I'm thinking that there can't be too many different things that would make the Tcase shift that much so that one seems like it makes the most sense.
Remember when I asked about the wobbling going on on the drivetrain ( shifters, clutch and gas pedal and steering wheel) That had to have been it. They were probably loose and on their way out and that or something over my head just pit the mail in the coffin. Better here than on a trail in the middle of nowhere though... or going 65+ on the highway. Wow, That would have been a nightmare eh?!
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Got it, Thanks for the help guys. The drivers side motor mount is smoked.
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/n8whitie/DSCF0593.jpg)
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Well that will do it!!! glad you found the cause. Might be time for a MML that will help with DL angles maybe could reduce the wedge a bit in the rear too help ensure the pinion bearing stays lubed up and happy.
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http://www.google.com/products?q=52017534K
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Well that will do it!!! glad you found the cause. Might be time for a MML that will help with DL angles maybe could reduce the wedge a bit in the rear too help ensure the pinion bearing stays lubed up and happy.
He has a SYE with a CV driveshaft coming.
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The mounts are on the way. I'm taking my fiance to Carmel on the weekend of the 22nd for her bday so I'm going to have to wrench this week after work and hopefully get it all done by then. Its surreal to think that I'm actually going to have a Jepp thats worth a sh!t on a trail now. We have to hit the junk yards pretty soon Jeffy and look for an 8.8 or D44.
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no such thing as too much oil on a pinion bearing. that was my main point, of course his DL angle will be good with the new DS
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The mounts are on the way. I'm taking my fiance to Carmel on the weekend of the 22nd for her bday so I'm going to have to wrench this week after work and hopefully get it all done by then. Its surreal to think that I'm actually going to have a Jepp thats worth a sh!t on a trail now. We have to hit the junk yards pretty soon Jeffy and look for an 8.8 or D44.
Well let me know, I'll go with you.
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i still don't understand how that can cause the t-case end to shift 3 or 4 inches to the passenger side
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I figured with that mount busted the motor was jumping around for a while working the tranny mounts out of place whih in turn would move the tcase as well.
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I figured with that mount busted the motor was jumping around for a while working the tranny mounts out of place whih in turn would move the tcase as well.
ok, i understand that being the cause of the transmision mount failing but that rubber being broken will not cause your t-case to be that far off to the right, did you check the transmission mount?
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Well let me know, I'll go with you.
Devils 3 way? :naughty:
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Lets do it. I'm good for the weekend of the 29th if thats good for you guys.