Author Topic: Missing tack bar in front?  (Read 3704 times)

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Steve-0

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Missing tack bar in front?
« on: October 20, 2009, 12:39:01 PM »
Apparently the PO of my YJ put in a front end that does not match. It is missing the track bar or something (per alignment shop) so it twists a bit when I hit the gas and then pulls to the right when I let off the gas and real bad when I hit the breaks. And I think he said the perches are wrong on it too. It is obviously a Jeep axel, but what the hell is it? Also, what does the stabilizer bars do if taken off? They are also off. Is it better for flexing? I have no idea.

Thanks

Steve-0

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2009, 12:43:07 PM »
Well, here is the answer to one of my questions...
Jeep Wrangler owners have been removing stabilizer links (also known as sway bar links) from the sway bar for off-roading purposes for many years. Some have replaced the links with "quick disconnect" links so they can take them off when four-wheeling and then replace them when driving on regular roads for normal steering support. Sway bars limit the rolling or rolling over of a vehicle when taking sharp turns at higher speeds. When the Jeep Wrangler is maneuvering on four-wheel-drive roads (at lower speeds) it's a benefit to remove the sway bar connection (the sway bar or stabilizer links) and allow less torsion and more maneuverability in the vehicle.
But what about the "twist" in the Jeep as mentioned earlier?

Offline oldjeep

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2009, 12:52:31 PM »
What you seem to be describing is bump steer.

As for the "bar"  - are you talking about the sway bar or the track bar?

Take a picture of your front axle.  Most of the most laughable diagnosis I hear on jeeps come from somebodies "Mechanic"
« Last Edit: October 20, 2009, 12:53:37 PM by oldjeep »
Chuck P
The clowns'? Oh, yeah, the clowns. We fight them too — entire armies, spilling out of Volkswagons. We do our best to fight them off, but they keep sending 'em in!
94 YJ - gone
98 ZJ - sons truck
97 TJ - daughters project

www.oldjeep.com

Offline neale_rs

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2009, 01:01:23 PM »
Is your Jeep lifted?  From the amount of bump steer you are describing, it sounds like you probably have some lift and really soft springs.  With stiffer springs (on a YJ) you can remove both the track and sway bars and it keeps handling fairly well, nothing like what you describe.

A picture would help a lot.
'95 YJ, 33 x 12.5 mud tires, RE 4.5 ED lift, Atlas 4 speed, rear D44, ARBs front and rear, 4.56 gears, 8000# winch

Offline sharpxmen

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2009, 01:37:52 PM »
i removed the sway bar a long time ago and didn't notice any roll, but i do have a pretty stiff suspension; i also had no behaviour like you describe. Some of the symptoms you mentioned seem to point to the fact that your jeep rolls somewhat sideways (at an angle), usually the way to tell is to roll it forward for 20 feet or so with the wheels straight, stop the vehicle and measure the distance between the center of the u-bolt plates on each side between front and rear and then diagonally - the result should be the same between measurements - if it isn't then you know there's a problem (can also be a bent leaf).  The alignment shop should have already done that, you might want to ask them and see if they did and what was the result.

The softer the ride the more you notice the sway bar. The higher the lift the more you would notice the track bar - that's just because the point where the axle is bolted to the leafs is so much farther down from the leaf eye bushings as you have lift. Some guys here run with no track bars, since i have not tried it i can't really give a first hand opinion on it, but if I would be to guess if you would compare a SOA that gives you 3'' of lift with stock leafs (not sure if it's accurate but probably close enough) compared to a SUA 3'' lift you would probably notice less if you remove the track bar in the SOA setup.

you can see if you're missing the track bar and/or sway bar right away by looking under your jeep, the track bar is a bar that goes between the frame to the axle in the front, bolts onto a support on the drivers' side frame rail and on another support on the axle tube on the passenger side, the sway bar links you can see behind the front wheels, the links are connected to the ubolt plates and go to the sway bar from there.

like others said, a picture (or more) of your front axle would help to get better answers
'95 YJ, NSG370 6spd / Hurst shifter, Dana 300 + 4:1 Doubler / tri-stick, Custom skid, Super D35 / Auburn LSD / 4.88, 35x12.5x15 BFG KM2, 64mm t/b, 1.7 RollerRockers, MkVIII e-fan, Dual Diaph Booster
Latest: Corbeau BajaRS heated seats :dance: keeping warm the rear end

Steve-0

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Re: Missing drag link in front?
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2009, 04:55:06 PM »
Yes, I will get some pictures for you guys in a few hours. And it was the drag link, not track bar.

Offline Bounty Hunter

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2009, 05:35:10 PM »
You wouldn't be able to drive it without a draglink, it's part of your steering linkage and connects the steering box to the tierod.  The tierod is the steering bar between both tires that turn the steering knuckles.

Even without a swaybar or trackbar, your jeep should not handle as poorly as you describe.  Sounds like there's other issues at play here than simply missing parts.

Offline neale_rs

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2009, 05:51:31 PM »
Maybe some leaves are broken.
'95 YJ, 33 x 12.5 mud tires, RE 4.5 ED lift, Atlas 4 speed, rear D44, ARBs front and rear, 4.56 gears, 8000# winch

Offline oldjeep

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Re: Missing drag link in front?
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2009, 06:07:37 PM »
Yes, I will get some pictures for you guys in a few hours. And it was the drag link, not track bar.

Well that would certainly make it swerve wildly  :drink:
Chuck P
The clowns'? Oh, yeah, the clowns. We fight them too — entire armies, spilling out of Volkswagons. We do our best to fight them off, but they keep sending 'em in!
94 YJ - gone
98 ZJ - sons truck
97 TJ - daughters project

www.oldjeep.com

Steve-0

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2009, 01:05:06 AM »
Ok, this info came from LesSchwab. Those of us from the Pac NW know who these guys are. Take a look at these pictures and tell me if there is something missing here... See the first picture? Please forgive my poor drawing but you get the point. Isn't there supposed to be something there? And as you can see there were new perches welded for the rear. See the tag. Can you tell me what rear end I have? I think it still said 4 11 gears. The last one is the stamp on my front end. What can you tell me?







« Last Edit: October 21, 2009, 01:11:58 AM by Steve-0 »

Offline aw12345

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2009, 05:07:39 AM »
You have a YJ with the trackbars removed, this gets done to improve flex so long as the spring bushings and shackle bushings are in good shape it should not really have to much of a negative impact on street driving and  handling. It actually gives the Jeep a somewhat softer ride on the street
2006 Jeep Wrangler TJ SE
2004 Jeep Wrangler TJ SE

Offline sharpxmen

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2009, 08:25:10 AM »
yep, no trackbars or swaybar - trackbars are pretty easy to install, you will need a ratcheting strap and the bars from a junkyard (the nuts/bolts too), you could try them out and see how much improvement you get, but i recommend to have it checked out afterwards for alignment (not just the front) since you have a lift and no relocation brackets for these.
'95 YJ, NSG370 6spd / Hurst shifter, Dana 300 + 4:1 Doubler / tri-stick, Custom skid, Super D35 / Auburn LSD / 4.88, 35x12.5x15 BFG KM2, 64mm t/b, 1.7 RollerRockers, MkVIII e-fan, Dual Diaph Booster
Latest: Corbeau BajaRS heated seats :dance: keeping warm the rear end

Offline jfrabat

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2009, 08:37:46 AM »
You defenetly dont have a trackbar, but this should not be the cause of the problem (it probably increases the effect, but it is not the cause).  My reasoning is that (1) lots of people run YJ's without trackbars (my rear one is removed, for example, and many other remove both rear and front), and (2) IIRC, CJ's came without the track bar.  Now, if you want to install the trackbar, you can also get a JKS telescoping trackbar, which you can loosen up for offroading (which increases flex and softens the ride) and tighten up for street driving.  I run one of these, and I am happy with it.  But again, I think there is something else causing the problem...   Maybe bump steer or something...
'94 YJ 2.5L with 4" RE lift, Superwinch EPi9.0, FoMoCo e-Fan, SD30 and SD35 w/ARB-5.13, 165A alt., 33" BFG KM2 on 15" AR wheels, Sony sound system, Pavement Ends Hardtop, Hydroboost

Offline neale_rs

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2009, 08:55:21 AM »
Check for worn bushings and broken leaves.  I´m assuming the alignment shop has already ruled out worn bearings and ball joints.
'95 YJ, 33 x 12.5 mud tires, RE 4.5 ED lift, Atlas 4 speed, rear D44, ARBs front and rear, 4.56 gears, 8000# winch

Offline sharpxmen

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Re: Missing tack bar in front?
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2009, 09:12:53 AM »
Check for worn bushings and broken leaves.  I´m assuming the alignment shop has already ruled out worn bearings and ball joints.

x2 on worn/bad bushings - with not trackbars that would explain the problems you're having.
'95 YJ, NSG370 6spd / Hurst shifter, Dana 300 + 4:1 Doubler / tri-stick, Custom skid, Super D35 / Auburn LSD / 4.88, 35x12.5x15 BFG KM2, 64mm t/b, 1.7 RollerRockers, MkVIII e-fan, Dual Diaph Booster
Latest: Corbeau BajaRS heated seats :dance: keeping warm the rear end