Topic: Is it just me or would it be awesome to put a toyota sienna engine in a jeep?

[jcoleman]

I have no idea the practicality of this, or even if it is at all possible.  However it's a v6 with anywhere from 210-266hp and 220 - 260 lb ft torque depending on the year! and it gets about 24 mpg highway 18 city.  I drove my mother's sienna to take a few guys I know to Dulles Airport and back yesterday, and i drove roughly 330 miles because i had to take some detours for traffic. (i live in Williamsburg).  I used roughly 3/4 of a tank and filled it up from E with 16 gallons.  That puts my mpg at 26 27ish.  that's some stop and go, 60 to 70 to 80mph.  and this baby will burn some rubber on acceleration too  .  Any way all this power and efficiency makes me want to put it in my crap power crappy efficiency jeep.  Now of course the jeep is far less aerodynamic than the sienna. but I had 4 adult males in the car with about 300lbs of luggage on top of the fact that the sienna weighs more.  So I'm pretty sure I would still be getting similar numbers.

Anyway, just a stupid thought.  I would probably never have the money or time to do such a swap because of all the modification involved.  I guess I can only hope my mom totals here sienna.    At which point I will be asking many a question about what all is involved.

[Jeffy]

I have no idea the practicality of this, or even if it is at all possible.  However it's a v6 with anywhere from 210-266hp and 220 - 260 lb ft torque depending on the year! and it gets about 24 mpg highway 18 city.  I drove my mother's sienna to take a few guys I know to Dulles Airport and back yesterday, and i drove roughly 330 miles because i had to take some detours for traffic. (i live in Williamsburg).  I used roughly 3/4 of a tank and filled it up from E with 16 gallons.  That puts my mpg at 26 27ish.  that's some stop and go, 60 to 70 to 80mph.  and this baby will burn some rubber on acceleration too  .  Any way all this power and efficiency makes me want to put it in my crap power crappy efficiency jeep.  Now of course the jeep is far less aerodynamic than the sienna. but I had 4 adult males in the car with about 300lbs of luggage on top of the fact that the sienna weighs more.  So I'm pretty sure I would still be getting similar numbers.

Anyway, just a stupid thought.  I would probably never have the money or time to do such a swap because of all the modification involved.  I guess I can only hope my mom totals here sienna.    At which point I will be asking many a question about what all is involved.

The engine is a transverse engine so it's pointed the wrong way.  This causes a bunch of problems when trying to turn it around.  Then you've got to find a transmission that will work with it.  FWD's don't have nearly as much parasitic drag as a Jeep does so that will cut down on it's mileage.  THEN you have aerodynamics...

If you really want a Toyota engine you'd probably be better off using a 2RZ-FE, 3RZ-FE or a 5VZ-FE.  Or better yet if you don't have inspections, a 2LT-E.

[jcoleman]

what exactly is parasitic drag?  And like I said, if only it would somehow work. haha.

[jcoleman]

and a 2lte would be nice if I could find one, and make sure it didn't have issues with the head.  Read a few different places before that it is prone to overheating and the head cracking.  Also the 5vzfe would probably be much easier to obtain.  of course gas mileage would be sacrificed.  Still a far more efficient/reliable engine than the jeep's, and is easily supercharged because of the trd supercharger.

[chardrc]

avenger makes a supercharger for the 2.5l and 2.4l jeep 4bangers. 

[Jeffy]

what exactly is parasitic drag?  And like I said, if only it would somehow work. haha.

That's the drag from things like larger tires, having to turn the front axle shafts which turn the wheel bearings, which go through the carrier bearings which turn the carrier which turns the pinion and pinion bearing, then turns the driveshaft which turns the transfer case input shaft which then does nothing. This is for a TJ.  On a YJ, you could stop at the carrier but then include the spider and side gears.  It's wasted energy.

[Jeffy]

and a 2lte would be nice if I could find one, and make sure it didn't have issues with the head.  Read a few different places before that it is prone to overheating and the head cracking.  Also the 5vzfe would probably be much easier to obtain.  of course gas mileage would be sacrificed.  Still a far more efficient/reliable engine than the jeep's, and is easily supercharged because of the trd supercharger.

Like I said, if you don't have to deal with inspections a 2LT-E wouldn't be difficult to do.  Half-cuts are imported all the time.

[Jeffy]

avenger makes a supercharger for the 2.5l and 2.4l jeep 4bangers. 

Not really in the same league I'm afraid.

[jcoleman]

what exactly is parasitic drag?  And like I said, if only it would somehow work. haha.

That's the drag from things like larger tires, having to turn the front axle shafts which turn the wheel bearings, which go through the carrier bearings which turn the carrier which turns the pinion and pinion bearing, then turns the driveshaft which turns the transfer case input shaft which then does nothing. This is for a TJ.  On a YJ, you could stop at the carrier but then include the spider and side gears.  It's wasted energy.

gotcha.

[Jeffy]

gotcha.

Actually, I forgot a bunch more.  You have the drag from going through the transfer case then you have the drag going through the driveshaft then the rear axle.  (Sienna is FWD)  So in all you are dragging a few dead bodies behind you.

[jcoleman]

so wait. i'm a bit confused. the parasitic drag is pretty much just energy being lost because of all the moving parts from the engine to the wheels.  but did you just say that when my front axel rotates (in 2wd) the front driveshaft also rotates but just doesn't connect to the transfer case? sorry if that was confusing, i'll try to rephrase... all the shit in the front rotates when the car is in motion, but is not powered by the engine through the transfer case, correct?

and second, how might i drag a few less dead bodies?

[Jeffy]

so wait. i'm a bit confused. the parasitic drag is pretty much just energy being lost because of all the moving parts from the engine to the wheels.  but did you just say that when my front axel rotates (in 2wd) the front driveshaft also rotates but just doesn't connect to the transfer case? sorry if that was confusing, i'll try to rephrase... all the [censored] in the front rotates when the car is in motion, but is not powered by the engine through the transfer case, correct?

and second, how might i drag a few less dead bodies?

What it boils down to is that there are a lot more moving parts (powered and unpowered that have to move) in a Jeep (4wd) vs. a minivan (FWD).

There isn't much you can do.  Most of it is inherent with the design.  Going with skinnier tires will decrease the rolling resistance which helps but it's a bit counter to what a 4wd needs.  Getting a front axle with manual disconnects helps but you'll be countering that with more weight.  There are some things that can help in more ways when one.  Using lighter wheels and tires.  I believe for every pound of weight added to the wheels and tires (rotational weight) equates to 2lbs of dead weight.  Also, for every 100lbs shed you gain 1HP.  You can get it down to a certain point but really you're better off driving something else.  It's all about giving and taking, what you can live without.  You don't want to be driving a Jeep made of paper mache.

Still, if you want to get into the 20MPG range, an engine swap is probably the way to go.  Diesel will of course get you higher.  Engine wise, I don't think a Toyota is a bad choice.

[jcoleman]

thanks for the info.  i'll probably be looking into some sort of conversion down the road.  Down a very very long road.

[chrisfranklin]

Me, I was thinking a Lexus V8 ripped out of an older LS400 Sedan. Of course, for all the trouble involved you might as well buy a V8 Landcruiser.   

[dunklervogel]

Just take a look at some of the fwd cars hp at the wheels and hp at the flywheel.  The gap is much smaller than in a jeep or other suv or truck.  I believe I read in a thread somewhere that a guy with a fairly stock 2.5 dyno'd at like 80 something rhp when the engine makes 120-130 fhp.