Author Topic: Camping equipment  (Read 5333 times)

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Offline VA_YJ

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Re: Camping equipment
« Reply #30 on: October 01, 2013, 11:48:09 AM »
A few thoughts:

White Gas vs. Propane

Propane is easier to light, initial cost is usually lower. Disadvatages include higher fuel costs, empty canisters, poor performance in cooler weather (refrigeration effect from expanding gas).  You can not top off half used canisters (unless you have a way to fill the small canisters from a large propane bottle).

White gas works in all conditions and Coleman fuel (burns clean) is less costly than propane.  If you know the correct procedure, white gas stoves are still easy to light.  Stoves typically cost more. I am a white gas fan - makes sense if you camp a lot and in all kinds of weather.  I use an Optimus Nova (multifuel) and a have an old Coleman two burner.  It is easy to top off partially filled fuel bottles.  You can also use white gas to start a fire in an emergency (we call it Girl Scout fluid).

Tents - as Bounty pointed out, the real issue is wind - cheap walmart tents with fiberglass poles will fold up like a cheap suit if the wind kicks up in the mountains.  Look for metal poles.  I like Eureka (used by the military) and Sierra Designs tents.

Sleeping bags - synthetic fill is better for wet climates, down works great for cold, dry conditions.  I like North Face and Marmot bags, but they're a bit pricey.  The Kelty bags are a good bargain.  With the high end bags, you're paying for lightweight, not so much of an issue when car camping.  I have purchased a few high end bags at great prices off of e-bay.  I have North Face down bag that I purchased in 1975 and I still use it for Winter camping.  Don't store in a compressed bag and they'll last a long time.

FYI - A good source for Camping gear is campmor.com
95 YJ, 31 BFG ATs, 4.0 TB & spacer, Banks header, DynoMax CAT back, 19# inj, AEM CAI, 20 gal mod, Optima yellow
98 TJ, 35 BFG Krawlers, 4.0 liter, ax15, atlas 5:1, armor, Super 88 (under construction)
96 XJ Cheep Cherokee, 33s, 4.0 liter, AW4, future project
89 Waggy, 360 V8 727 dana 44s, it runs

Offline Jeffy

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Re: Camping equipment
« Reply #31 on: October 01, 2013, 11:36:37 PM »
Argh! now I'm looking back at the Coleman 2-burner dual-fuel's...   Although I don't plan on camping near to or below 0.  Probably 4-6000 ft.  I think propane edges out white fuel for what I need though.

In any case,  they have the DUAL FUEL™ 2-BURNER STOVE and the DUAL FUEL™ POWERHOUSE 2-BURNER STOVE.  The difference is size and BTU.  Interestingly enough there doesn't really seem to be much choice 2-burner multi-fuel stoves.  All of the other companies seem to focus on backpacking stoves or single-burners.

DUAL FUEL™ 2-BURNER STOVE
Stove burns Coleman® liquid fuel or unleaded gasoline (Fuel sold separately)
14,000 BTU in two powerful, high performance Band-a-Blu™ burners
Primary burner is 7,500 BTU, auxiliary burner is 6,500 BTU
Tank capacity is 2.5 pints
Runtime is about two hours with both burners on high
Heavy duty nickel chrome grate is removable for easy cleaning
Limited 5 Year warranty
Dimensions: 20.13 in. x 12.88 in. x 6.63 in. (51.13 cm x 32.72 cm 16.84 cm)
Made in the USA of US and foreign components


DUAL FUEL™ POWERHOUSE 2-BURNER STOVE
Stove burns Coleman® liquid fuel or unleaded gasoline (Fuel sold separately)
17,000 BTU in two powerful, high performance Band-a-Blu™ burners
Primary burner is 9,000 BTU, auxiliary burner is 8,000 BTU
Tank capacity is 3.5 pints
Runtime: Up to 2.3 hours on high
Heavy duty nickel chrome grate is removable for easy cleaning
Limited 5 Year warranty
Dimensions: 21.75 in. x 13.5 in. X 6 in. (55.25 cm x 34.29 cm x 15.24 cm)
Made in the USA of US and foreign components
« Last Edit: October 01, 2013, 11:48:44 PM by Jeffy »
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Offline Jeffy

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Re: Camping equipment
« Reply #32 on: October 02, 2013, 12:01:56 AM »
Here's what this guy says about Propane vs. White Gas.

Question Propane vs White Gas

Howdy Campateers,
Here's another subject to toss around and compare notes. It's a forum, so everyone's $0.02 is worth a lot more these days. So allow me to get the ball rolling....

Propane is one the easiest fuel source to use. All you do is screw it on and light the gas. Because propane is already under pressure you do not have to pump it or do anything special. Propane has to be under pressure because its boiling point (point when it turns from a liquid to a gas) is negative 44 degrees Fahrenheit. This means that it is normally a gas. In order to turn it into a liquid you need to pressurize it, which is why it is stored in strong metal containers.

All you do with propane is screw on the container, turn on the valve, and light the gas that is exiting out of the burners. Very simple when compared to other white gas.

With white gas (Coleman fuel) you have to pump the container up, heat up a bit of the fuel, and then ignite it. So it obviously takes more time to set up and start a white gas stove then it does for a propane stove.

Another benefit to propane gas is it is easy to handle the transport. You do not have to worry about filling it up, spilling fuel, or priming it. This makes it the idea fuel source for individuals new to the outdoor/camping experience.

One of the problems is you cannot use propane in very low temperatures. If it is just 40 degrees then you should have much of a problem. But if you plan on camping in the snow or where it is 0 degrees then you need another fuel source like white gas. White gas does not have this issue.

White gas is commonly thought of as a hotter fuel source. While I have not tested this I believe it to be true. So you will use less fuel to heat up the same amount of water. An advantage of white gas vs. propane.

There is another issue with propane if you go backpacking. The containers are heavy and are not disposable. You usually do not have a trash can on the top of the mountain so you will be forced to pack it down with you. I know you have to do that with your white gas container but they are lighter and smaller. And for backpackers every ounce counts.

More important than extra weight (in my opinion) is that you cannot refill the small propane canisters. Instead you are forced to trash them into a landfill. With white gas stoves you just refill the container.

Propane has another issue when it comes to cooking. When propane burns it produces heat, light, carbon dioxide, and water. So the water vapor will come in contact with your food and does effect how it is cooked ever so slightly. This is why some snobbish chef’s (like on Iron Chef) refuse to cook with the gas in the stadium and instead us charcoal or another dry fuel source. This is also one of the reasons why I like to use charcoal to cook instead of propane, the other is briquettes also impart a nice flavor.

One of the nice features about some white gas stoves is many of them can use alternative fuel sources. This is nice if you are in a country that doesn’t sell propane then you can easily use their fuel sources. But keep in mind that not all stoves have this as an option and many other forms of fuel do not burn as cleanly as propane. Every propane stove I know of only burns propane.

How do you know how much propane is left?
There are two ways of figuring out how much propane you have left. One way is to see how heavy it is. Now this requires you to know exactly how much an empty container weights but it is one option and you have to have good measuring skills. The other option is to use hot water. Just pour hot water along the side of the container. Then wait a few seconds. Then touch the side. The propane container will have a hot spot and a cooler spot. Right at the point where there is a temperature difference then that is where the liquid propane level is.

Another method is to purchase the new fiberglass propane refillable canisters 3 1/2 gallon to 20 gallon tanks. One can see the level because they are see through canisters. However, they cost three times as much as the steel canisters. I have two fiberglass models and two steel models but rarely take all four camping unless it's camping for ten - fifteen days.

Advantages of propane when compared to white gas.
-Easier to start a stove or lantern.
-Easier to replace, just disconnect and reconnect a new container.
-If spilled or compromised, it will just be released into the air and not contaminate the ground.
-It is less likely to leak.

Disadvantages of propane when compared to white gas.
-Won’t work in very cold weather (around 0 degrees.)
-Most small propane canisters are not refillable.
-Not as hot as white gas.
-Heavier than white gas.
-More expensive per pound
-Harder to find in some areas of the country and/or world.

Ok, what fuel should I use?
Propane is easier and less of a hassle. Coleman makes some of the best stoves and lanterns so that is a brand I would start with. If you are going backpacking then I recommend getting a white gas single burner stove. If you are caught in a cold environment then at least you won’t have to worry about getting your stove lit. Thanks for lookin'!
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Offline Jeffy

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Re: Camping equipment
« Reply #33 on: October 06, 2013, 02:20:56 PM »
Well, I went to REI and checked out what they have.  The Primus looks almost exactly like the StanSport and the Camp Chef.  I would guess they are made at the same factory with minor differences.  They had one lone Coleman dual-fuel but it looks like they sell propane stoves 10:1 if not more.  Check out some water carriers and it looks like all of Reliance cans are BPH free which is nice.  The 7 Gallon can is a little big but cheap.  The 5.5Gal/20L cans are a few bucks more and will fit in a NATO can carrier it looks like.  Haven't decided how to go about it.  Also check out some Rubbermade Action Packers.  I'm not sure if I'll go with drawers or just stack action packers or a combination of both.  I think it really depends on how much room I'll have with the fridge in the back.

Speaking of, had anyone added footman loops to their floor?  I've been thinking of adding some to the wheel well so I can strap my toolbox down or any other gear for that matter.
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"If the motor car were invented today, there is absolutely no way that any government in the world would let normal members of the public drive one."

Offline VA_YJ

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Re: Camping equipment
« Reply #34 on: October 07, 2013, 02:42:24 PM »
I've scrapped a few Ford Explorers (to extract 8.8 axles and other Jeep parts).  The 1996-1999 models that I usually look for have folding tie-down hooks that bolt to the floor.  You could pick up some of these and mount to your floor (using washers or plates for reinforcement).  I will look and see if I have any lying around if you are interested.

95 YJ, 31 BFG ATs, 4.0 TB & spacer, Banks header, DynoMax CAT back, 19# inj, AEM CAI, 20 gal mod, Optima yellow
98 TJ, 35 BFG Krawlers, 4.0 liter, ax15, atlas 5:1, armor, Super 88 (under construction)
96 XJ Cheep Cherokee, 33s, 4.0 liter, AW4, future project
89 Waggy, 360 V8 727 dana 44s, it runs

Offline Jeffy

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Re: Camping equipment
« Reply #35 on: October 09, 2013, 02:57:51 PM »
I'm more looking at the smaller footman loops for a 1" strap.  Kinda like the ones on the floor next to the door openings.  For the back, I'm not sure what I'll use just yet.

Anyone else got anything on tents?  I'm hearing metal poles over fiberglass and clips over sleeves.  I hate sleeves.
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"If the motor car were invented today, there is absolutely no way that any government in the world would let normal members of the public drive one."

Offline Jeffy

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Re: Camping equipment
« Reply #36 on: November 24, 2013, 11:53:31 PM »
Okay here's a bump.

I'm now thinking about getting an Oztent RV-2.  One of the problems I've come across with a rooftop tent is that camp sites are usually marked by your tent.  If it's on the Jeep and I need to drive somewhere, the tent goes with it.  The OZTent seems to get good reviews.  Setup is supposed to be 30 seconds.  I also like how I can park the Jeep in the opening or even attach the awning to the roof rack.  There are sides you can attach to the opening to give you a changing room or give you a lounge that's protected.

I was also looking at the ARB Skydome Swag tent but they're awfully small.  I like having room to throw my clothes and other gear so it's not in the weather.  The awning is nice when you've got muddy/dusty/etc... boots

Anyone have an OzTent?  Thoughts?



Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZNlr60GXH5OlKIFrT7P6mg
My Jeep: http://4bangerjp.com/forums/index.php?topic=2783.0
"If the motor car were invented today, there is absolutely no way that any government in the world would let normal members of the public drive one."

Offline Jeffy

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Re: Camping equipment
« Reply #37 on: November 26, 2013, 10:07:07 PM »
How about a Kodiak Canvas Flex-Bow 4-Person Canvas Tent?  ANyone have one of those?
Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZNlr60GXH5OlKIFrT7P6mg
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"If the motor car were invented today, there is absolutely no way that any government in the world would let normal members of the public drive one."