Topic: cherokee trany options

[Thaddeaus]

i have a 93 cherokee 2wd that i want to covert to 4wd and was wondering if the trany and axles would work out of a 4.0l and what are the stock gear ratios in a cherokee?

[Jeffy]

3.07, 3.54, 3.73 & 4.10 just like all of the other Jeeps.  if you're keeping the 2.5L then you'll need to use a transmission from a 2.5L.  Now I'm not sure if you'll be able to remove the tail cone and swap a transfer case on there but you'll have to be aware of spline counts on the transfer case input shaft.  The 4.0L is 23 while the 2.5L uses a 21 spline.  Although there are not only spline count differences but depth of the shaft.  In all there are 5 different shafts.  Transmissions are engine specific.  4.0L will have either a AX-15 5-speed or an RH32/TF999 3-speed.  A 2.5L will have a AX-5 5-speed or a RH30/TF904 3-speed.

[Mr_Random]

3.07, 3.54, 3.73 & 4.10 just like all of the other Jeeps.  if you're keeping the 2.5L then you'll need to use a transmission from a 2.5L.  Now I'm not sure if you'll be able to remove the tail cone and swap a transfer case on there but you'll have to be aware of spline counts on the transfer case input shaft.  The 4.0L is 23 while the 2.5L uses a 21 spline.  Although there are not only spline count differences but depth of the shaft.  In all there are 5 different shafts.  Transmissions are engine specific.  4.0L will have either a AX-15 5-speed or an RH32/TF999 3-speed.  A 2.5L will have a AX-5 5-speed or a RH30/TF904 3-speed.

Jeffy... did someone forget the aw4? It's not exactly preferable behind the 2.5, I know (heck, nothing but a five speed is), but it was used behind them too.

PO: Transmission swappability is very widely discussed on here. The best case scenario when swapping to 4wd is ax-15 (or nv3550?), np231, dakota 2.5L bellhousing, and the appropriate parts to adapt other things. There is at least one recent thread on here about ax-15 swaps that will link to other information sources. This swap is kinda like a "full optioned" one.

Otherwise I believe the tailcone of your ax-5 can pull off and adapt to the correct np231 (21 spline).

axles: you'll want a 2.5 XJ front axle, it'll be an HP30 with 4.10's (most likely). Otherwise a 2.5L TJ (I think ZJ and WJ are the same) LP30 will bolt in but wont be as strong. Last viable choice is a 2.5 YJ HP30, which will fit and all but require brackets (which can be pulled off your current "axle" as needed). Same information applies to all jeep 4.0 front axles, except most will have to be regeared to match the rear.

as always, anyone correct me if I'm wrong. Good luck!

[oldjeep]

Jeffy... did someone forget the aw4? It's not exactly preferable behind the 2.5, I know (heck, nothing but a five speed is), but it was used behind them too.

No such thing as an AW4 in a 2.5L 93.   AW4 was only used in the 87-89 renix era 2.5L.  There is no stock flexplate that works with a non renix 2.5L and AW4

[Bounty Hunter]

I don't think you can convert a 2wd 5spd in a jeep to a 4wd transmission without a complete tear-down and rebuild with a 4wd output shaft and housing.

Your best bet is to find a 4wd donor vehicle with a similar drivetrain.  Finding an AW4 that came behind the 2.5L would be a good option, although I believe it's more rare.

The most common 4.0L XJ axle gear ratios are 3.55 (auto) and 3.07 (5spd).  2.5L gear ratios are 3.73 (auto) and 4.10 (5spd), with a very rare 4.56 out there as well.  

[Mr_Random]

No such thing as an AW4 in a 2.5L 93.   AW4 was only used in the 87-89 renix era 2.5L.  There is no stock flexplate that works with a non renix 2.5L and AW4

Okay, I'll consider that information as correct. The flexplate problem makes sense in any case...

and Bounty Hunter, I think you are right about the output shaft/shifter housing needing to be rebuilt to fit. As soon as I posted I thought of that possibility, so you're probably right.

[Jeffy]

4.56's on a stock XJ would need to be a '84-87 2.5L, IIRC which were rare of the rare.  The BOM is 610183-5.

For axles, you want an XJ D30 but not any one.  You'll want a one from a later model XJ.  Later the better.  Stay away from the earlier ones with the vacuum disconnect.  It will be a High-pinion and if you get one from '94-up, you'll probably get the stronger U-joints as well.  I'd stick with an XJ D30 since these are the best of the bunch.

Everything else uses a low pinion housing and except for the YJ, use crush sleeves for the pinion bearing preload.  This makes for an extra step in installing gears and also makes the gears specific to those axles as the pinion gear is different to accommodate the crush sleeve.  Some say the crush sleeve design is weaker but I've never heard of a problems directly related to the sleeve.

'93-'98 model ZJ's also started using weaker CV joints instead of U-joints at the axles.  This continued with the WJ as well.  If you plan on going offroad then the U-joint setup is better.

[DodgeMudder]

i have a 93 cherokee 2wd that i want to covert to 4wd and was wondering if the trany and axles would work out of a 4.0l and what are the stock gear ratios in a cherokee?

If your looking to do this with a 5spd, and want to do it on the cheap I have everything you would need, (I have a 2.5l 5spd '87 XJ that I'm parting).  If your close enough to meet with parts or are willing to pay shipping I can hook you up.

[oldjeep]

If your looking to do this with a 5spd, and want to do it on the cheap I have everything you would need, (I have a 2.5l 5spd '87 XJ that I'm parting).  If your close enough to meet with parts or are willing to pay shipping I can hook you up.

That would be a pretty poor swap.  He should already have an external slave AX5.  An 87 XJ would be an internal slave and could be a peugeot tranny.

Best bet would be to go to the junkyard and pull everything you need from a 91-95 cherokee.  I did the 4wd swap on a 4cyl 2wd MJ a few years ago.  Pulled everything I needed from a single cherokee Wasn't too bad.

[Mr_Random]

That would be a pretty poor swap.  He should already have an external slave AX5.  An 87 XJ would be an internal slave and could be a peugeot tranny.

Best bet would be to go to the junkyard and pull everything you need from a 91-95 cherokee.  I did the 4wd swap on a 4cyl 2wd MJ a few years ago.  Pulled everything I needed from a single cherokee Wasn't too bad.

He can just re use his clutch/bellhousing, no problem there. It will still be the ax-5, it's behind the 2.5... therefore ax-5.

[Thaddeaus]

i have a internal slave can i change that to an external when i do the swap or is one better than the other? also does a 86 cherokee with a 2.8 have a ax-5 in it? because i found one with a bad engine. how much better is the ax-15? thanks for the info

[Mr_Random]

i have a internal slave can i change that to an external when i do the swap or is one better than the other? also does a 86 cherokee with a 2.8 have a ax-5 in it? because i found one with a bad engine. how much better is the ax-15? thanks for the info

Actually, if the 86 has a 5 speed it should be an external slave, and yes it'll be the ax-5. 87 saw a switch to internal, and I was kinda brain dead in my last post and wasn't paying attention to you having a 93 (again), which was one of the last years of internal.

Ax-15 is MUCH stronger; the ax-5 can barely hold up to the 2.5's (minimal) power, while the ax-15 can hold up to some good v8 power (nothing extreme though).

[Jeffy]

Ax-15 is MUCH stronger; the ax-5 can barely hold up to the 2.5's (minimal) power, while the ax-15 can hold up to some good v8 power (nothing extreme though).

I think ^^ is giving the AX-15 too much credit while downplaying the AX-5.  The AX-5 is a decent transmission and really considering it's a lightweight it does OK.  If it barely held up to a stock engine then it wouldn't hold up to forced induction.  Really though, it comes down to how smooth you are with the power and shifts. (and in many cases how the PO drove).

Another correction, Jeep didn't use the AX-15 till the second half of 1989, even with the XJ line.  So a 2.8L will most likely have a Peugeot BA10/5 transmission.  These are really hit and miss and not worth swapping.  Same goes for the 2.8L engine.  They were marginally better then the 2.5L.  The way you can tell is that the BA10/5 is a clam shell design so the housing will have a seam down the center line.

Really, if you're going to bother doing a transmission upgrade then I would recommend going with a NV3550 from a late model TJ.  These are medium duty transmissions like the AX-15 but exponentially stronger.  The NV3500's were used behind the 316/5.2L V8's and can handle the torque.  This would be the best option for a swap without having to shell out the big bucks for an NV4500.

I'd check the '86 for a Dana 44 rear axle but other then that I'd leave it unless you need body or suspension parts.  Oh and when looking at front axles, stay away from the vacuum disconnects.  I think the difference is if it has Quadra-trac or Select-trac but I'm not 100% certain.  They appeared in the late 80's.  Also stay away from the 2000+ Dana 30's as those are low-pinion.  Best case would be to find a 1995-1999 XJ and grab everything.

[Mr_Random]

Okay I'll give it to you that I'm downplaying the ax-5 too much...

But as far as I know, the ba10/5 never came behind the 2.8, only the t-5 and ax-5. The pukegoat was used only behind the 4.2 and 4.0 from 87-89. Note that the 2.8 was phased out as the wrangler, 4.0 cherokee, and ba 10/5 were introduced (87). I'm not trying to argue, as all information sources are subject to fault, so I can't be sure. I've read a bunch of different factory and aftermarket manuals, and they rarely perfectly agree.

I think ^^ is giving the AX-15 too much credit while downplaying the AX-5.  The AX-5 is a decent transmission and really considering it's a lightweight it does OK.  If it barely held up to a stock engine then it wouldn't hold up to forced induction.  Really though, it comes down to how smooth you are with the power and shifts. (and in many cases how the PO drove).

Another correction, Jeep didn't use the AX-15 till the second half of 1989, even with the XJ line.  So a 2.8L will most likely have a Peugeot BA10/5 transmission.  These are really hit and miss and not worth swapping.  Same goes for the 2.8L engine.  They were marginally better then the 2.5L.  The way you can tell is that the BA10/5 is a clam shell design so the housing will have a seam down the center line.

Really, if you're going to bother doing a transmission upgrade then I would recommend going with a NV3550 from a late model TJ.  These are medium duty transmissions like the AX-15 but exponentially stronger.  The NV3500's were used behind the 316/5.2L V8's and can handle the torque.  This would be the best option for a swap without having to shell out the big bucks for an NV4500.

I'd check the '86 for a Dana 44 rear axle but other then that I'd leave it unless you need body or suspension parts.  Oh and when looking at front axles, stay away from the vacuum disconnects.  I think the difference is if it has Quadra-trac or Select-trac but I'm not 100% certain.  They appeared in the late 80's.  Also stay away from the 2000+ Dana 30's as those are low-pinion.  Best case would be to find a 1995-1999 XJ and grab everything.

[Jeffy]

Okay I'll give it to you that I'm downplaying the ax-5 too much...

But as far as I know, the ba10/5 never came behind the 2.8, only the t-5 and ax-5. The pukegoat was used only behind the 4.2 and 4.0 from 87-89. Note that the 2.8 was phased out as the wrangler, 4.0 cherokee, and ba 10/5 were introduced (87). I'm not trying to argue, as all information sources are subject to fault, so I can't be sure. I've read a bunch of different factory and aftermarket manuals, and they rarely perfectly agree.

Now that I think about it, I think you're right, 1987-1989 on the BA10/5.  XJ stuff is the most confusing since it falls well into the AMC-era as well as continues into the Chrysler era.  There were several transitions going on at the same time.

I wouldn't even mess with a 2.8L though.  Well, unless you want to swap in a 3.4L or 3.6L but that's yet another swap.